Ulternative Player of the Season

Talk about the men in white, and everything Ulster!!

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Pick your player of the Season

Andy Warwick
0
No votes
Callum Black
0
No votes
Kyle McCall
0
No votes
Rory Best
0
No votes
Rob Herring
0
No votes
John Andrew
1
3%
Wiehahn Herbst
0
No votes
Ricky Lutton
1
3%
Rodney Ah You
2
5%
Franco Van Der Merwe
0
No votes
Alan O'Connor
0
No votes
Kieran Treadwell
2
5%
Pete Browne
0
No votes
Iain Henderson
0
No votes
Robbie Diack
0
No votes
Chris Henry
0
No votes
Sean Reidy
22
56%
Roger Wilson
0
No votes
Marcell Coetzee
0
No votes
Clive Ross
0
No votes
Matt Rea
0
No votes
Nick Timoney
0
No votes
Ruan Pienaar
1
3%
Paul Marshall
1
3%
Dave Shanahan
0
No votes
Paddy Jackson
0
No votes
Brett Heron
1
3%
Pete Nelson
0
No votes
Stuart McCloskey
0
No votes
Stuart Olding
0
No votes
Luke Marshall
0
No votes
Darren Cave
0
No votes
Charles Piutau
0
No votes
Andrew Trimble
0
No votes
Craig Gilroy
0
No votes
Jacob Stockdale
5
13%
Tommy Bowe
0
No votes
Rob Lyttle
0
No votes
Jared Payne
0
No votes
Louis Ludik
3
8%
 
Total votes: 39

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Dave
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Re: Ulternative Player of the Season

Post by Dave »

Everyone is a friend of mine.
I have my own tv channel, what have you got?
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Snipe Watson
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Re: Ulternative Player of the Season

Post by Snipe Watson »

Agh yer a man of the people Dave.
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ColinM
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Re: Ulternative Player of the Season

Post by ColinM »

BaggyTrousers wrote:
ColinM wrote:
Snipe Watson wrote:
Cap'n Grumpy wrote:Why do some still drone on about "letting players go"?

If you know that players were "let go" when under contract, fair enough, but when a player is out of contract you cannot stop a player from leaving if he wants to. The only consideration is whether Ulster tried hard enough to keep them and that has to be tempered against what another club or clubs are offering.

Instead we always seem to assume Ulster has a bottomless pit of money and can pay top dollar for every untested Tom Dick and Harry who might, just might, make the grade.

This is not a defence of Ulster, who inevitably get some things wrong and deservedly get slated, but sometimes they seem to be blamed for things which are just not in their control.
>appl >appl >appl Never let the facts get in the way of a bit of finger pointing.
There are very few players who have excelled after "being let go". I don't recall a lot of wailing and gnashing of teeth when Seymour left for Scotland.
The only players who left here for another club and were missed were: Tommy who was treated appallingly by D4; P3 and Jimmy Nagusa who were kicked out at the behest of D4 and now Ruan.
There are probably a couple of others we could argue about, but those are the ones who spring to mind.
Seymour, Whitten, Wilson, Bowe, Steenson, Afoa/BJB, Court, Farrell spring to mind.

Some of them went on to excel in their own right, some just werent adequatley replaced, some just went away and did their jobs proficiently and got more gametime than they would here, but all could have contributed hugely to UR if they'd been kept (and managed correctly)

Theres a host of guys who didnt make it of course, but the lions share went to Championship clubs or low end Pro12 clubs to try and build a career by playing weekly, cant think of any who really surprised us and made it.
Congratulations Grumps in the ongoing struggle against the "letting him go" mob of numpties. I've done my bit previously in this campaign but by their very nature, for Numpties repetition is sadly essential.

Let's take a quick look at Colin's list (generally non-Numptyish) what have we?

Seymour, has become excellent, I liked him but even I wasn't much fussed when he took the correct decision for his career & moved.
Dizzy, In the time he has been away there is no time barring injury crisis when he would have been first choice. Has done well but still, not a big loss, like Seymour an excellent career move. :thumleft:
Wilson, got to like Roger, really admire that he could play well above his recent level for his last hurrah, sadly his best years were given to Saints. That said, I still think we were really unlucky with the injury he got in his last Saints game, not sure he ever got back properly. Why he left is a different matter to "letting him go".
Tommy, another man who "had to go" for his international career, the D4 ballixes plus almost their entire retinue of tame news hacks wouldn't give Tommy the steam aff their pish until he showed how good he was "abroad". Injury has not been Tommy's friend since his return, not unlike Roger, lad has been through the mill.
Steenson, no question he would have been useful for a period, but not at the time he was "let go" :roll: He's decent but he's no Paddy Jackson. :D
Afoa, Pussywhipped sad ballix and proven liar, gave 18 months maximum & then took the absolute airmiling pish. Now, did someone mention a bad back? >EW
Court, LOOK ........... everyone loved big Tom but he was 33 when he left, we can hardly accuse UR od squandering the player. Another who the FIRFU ensured would move by only offering 1 year. Tom made a good move for his latter years, fair play to him, we got 8/9 good years out of him. In no way does he fit the "let him go" scenario.
Farrell see Dizzy. Who knows if he will become one to regret, after all we are choc-a-bloc with high class centres or so I'm told. :roll:

There you go, yet again the "let him go" brigade stands debunked. :D
Semantics, semantics Baggy. I was responding to Snipes post which said "The only players who left here for another club and were missed were..."

And as for the list I came up with in 30 seconds flat, based on that they left and were or were not missed:

Steenson - correct no PJ, but did we miss him in the days of tossing a coin between NOC and IHumph you bet your granny we did - did we let him go - different question
Dizzy: might have been no nailed on starter but was hard as nails and would have been in damn near every match day squad in these last few seasons, do squads need guys like him who are utterly reliable and never let the side down - course they do, do the Mexicans keep players like him on the books and win leagues - yes
Afoa: took less trips to NZ than Herbst has had injuries and Ah Dave has had trips to KFC. Do we miss having a world class THP? Yip; should we have tried to keep him - nope
Court: NONE of our current crop are fit to tie TCs boots no matter what his age, have we missed him - hugely. Should we have given him a 3 year contract at 33 - hindsight will be a wonderful thing but the man took up rugby late and may confound us all.
Farrell: actually played like a drain a few times for Ulster but always had something about him, we also had other centres with something about them not playing like drains. Did we miss him? probably not, but I reckon we might kick ourselves next year when we see him in red.
Dan Dare
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Re: Ulternative Player of the Season

Post by Dan Dare »

Bealham.....So he's not Shyte?

I think he is a very good player, you have to be to play in a pro 12 winning team and get those international Caps. He is not top star material or top end, but he is a good player who got better when he left. He is definitely good enough for our team, we could do with him.

It is always harder for players who are let go. The confidence must be drained when you are cut. I have nothing but admiration for players who stick with it and keep trying. When you are cut from an academy it makes it a lot harder, you have to think of making a living, getting a job. To keep persevering with rugby must be tough.
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Snipe Watson
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Re: Ulternative Player of the Season

Post by Snipe Watson »

ColinM wrote:
Semantics, semantics Baggy. I was responding to Snipes post which said "The only players who left here for another club and were missed were..."
OK let me respond then.
What I actually posted was:
I don't recall a lot of wailing and gnashing of teeth when Seymour left for Scotland.
The only players who left here for another club and were missed were: Tommy who was treated appallingly by D4; P3 and Jimmy Nagusa who were kicked out at the behest of D4 and now Ruan.
There are probably a couple of others we could argue about, but those are the ones who spring to mind.
Seymour - I've discussed
Whitten - Journeyman bosh merchant
Wilson - He left under a cloud with Neil Best although admittedly he wasn't the villain of the piece, but he burned a few bridges as he left.
Bowe - I've discussed
Steenson - Never rated him highly and still don't, little better than iHumph. Would have been a decent squad player.
Afoa - Did you object when Afoa left? I didn't he took liberties at an unprecedented level.
Court - Tom was a legend, but I think he was nearing his end when he left. His case is arguable, but we didn't exactly let him go.
Farrell - I remain unimpressed
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Dave
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Re: Ulternative Player of the Season

Post by Dave »

FOLK
I have my own tv channel, what have you got?
Bart S
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Re: Ulternative Player of the Season

Post by Bart S »

it always struck me that ulster gambled big a few years ago, with big money going into a few star names in the hope that they could bring success, but to some extent that left less money to build squad depth and therefore a greater reliance on the Academy. Ian Whitten would be a good example of this. A young guy who had broken into the matchday 23 but was unlikely to be a regular first choice and who then took a gamble for 1st team rugby by going to Exeter. I am sure Ulster would have liked to keep him but thought there were alternatives coming through. Ditto Scholes last season. Both felt they were good enough for regular 1st team opportunities and ulster could not give them that.

Of course the loss of someone like Whitten is highlighted by his success this season at a leading AP team and that we have had Jared, Ludik, Bowe, Trimble, Lyttle, Luke, olding, big Stu and Cave all injured/unavailable for a reasonable length of time during this season. We struggle sometimes to keep guys, yet leinster seem to be able to build squads and keep players.

To give some defence to UR, the general level of wailing on here at the time of departure of the players involved has seemed to be inversely proportional to the success the players have gone on to achieve.
Bart S
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Re: Ulternative Player of the Season

Post by Bart S »

Snipe Watson wrote:
ColinM wrote:
Semantics, semantics Baggy. I was responding to Snipes post which said "The only players who left here for another club and were missed were..."
OK let me respond then.
What I actually posted was:
I don't recall a lot of wailing and gnashing of teeth when Seymour left for Scotland.
The only players who left here for another club and were missed were: Tommy who was treated appallingly by D4; P3 and Jimmy Nagusa who were kicked out at the behest of D4 and now Ruan.
There are probably a couple of others we could argue about, but those are the ones who spring to mind.
Seymour - I've discussed
Whitten - Journeyman bosh merchant
Wilson - He left under a cloud with Neil Best although admittedly he wasn't the villain of the piece, but he burned a few bridges as he left.
Bowe - I've discussed
Steenson - Never rated him highly and still don't, little better than iHumph. Would have been a decent squad player.
Afoa - Did you object when Afoa left? I didn't he took liberties at an unprecedented level.
Court - Tom was a legend, but I think he was nearing his end when he left. His case is arguable, but we didn't exactly let him go.
Farrell - I remain unimpressed
Snipe whilst i understand the reasons why you may not rate Whitten and Steenson they have been important in Exter's relative success over the past few years. I am sure they would have done better than some of those we have kept or acquired in their positions and overall have improved Ulster's results and performances.
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Tender
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Re: Ulternative Player of the Season

Post by Tender »

Could ye all feck aff about players we let go? I just let a real ripper go and discussing its pungency and its ability to choke has more value than gurnin about who we don't have, or why we don't have them and if my synapses are firing correctly, I'll feel compelled to remind ya'll ITS BEEN DONE TO DEATH ON OTHER THREADS SO WHY THE FECK ARE YES HARPING ON ABOUT IT?

Meanwhile back at the ranch...
I was torn between Ludicrous and Reidy with Oxo hard on their heels, but plumped for Reidy and I'll stand the other two a pint when I see them.
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Cap'n Grumpy
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Re: Ulternative Player of the Season

Post by Cap'n Grumpy »

Guys, if it saves yousuns arguing about Dizzy, Ulster wanted, and tried to keep him.

Dizzy however, decided that a better career plan for him was a move to a team where he might get more regular first team appearances. At that time Exeter were still only finding their feet in the English Premier whatsit - yes they have come on great guns, but at the time, they were still an up and coming team and you can understand Dizzy's thinking about being a part of that.

Bottomline - was he let go? No!

As Mr T End says, maybe we should let it go! :thumleft:
I'm not arguing -
I'm just explaining why I'm right
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Cap'n Grumpy
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Re: Ulternative Player of the Season

Post by Cap'n Grumpy »

Dave wrote:Everyone is a friend of mine.
CAPTAIN Dave? :D

:salut: Cap'n G. (& Cap'n Morgan) >EW
I'm not arguing -
I'm just explaining why I'm right
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Dave
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Re: Ulternative Player of the Season

Post by Dave »

Cap'n Grumpy wrote:
Dave wrote:Everyone is a friend of mine.
CAPTAIN Dave? :D

:salut: Cap'n G. (& Cap'n Morgan) >EW
I'll take that, thanks.
I have my own tv channel, what have you got?
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Cap'n Grumpy
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Re: Ulternative Player of the Season

Post by Cap'n Grumpy »

Dave wrote:
Cap'n Grumpy wrote:
Dave wrote:Everyone is a friend of mine.
CAPTAIN Dave? :D

:salut: Cap'n G. (& Cap'n Morgan) >EW
I'll take that, thanks.
Only saw the advert for the first time a short while ago.

Does it redefine Davedom on this forum? :lol:
I'm not arguing -
I'm just explaining why I'm right
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Dave
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Re: Ulternative Player of the Season

Post by Dave »

Cap'n Grumpy wrote:
Dave wrote:
Cap'n Grumpy wrote:
Dave wrote:Everyone is a friend of mine.
CAPTAIN Dave? :D

:salut: Cap'n G. (& Cap'n Morgan) >EW
I'll take that, thanks.
Only saw the advert for the first time a short while ago.

Does it redefine Davedom on this forum? Image
Yes. Since Sarge is retiring, Rodney has been promoted.
I have my own tv channel, what have you got?
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Snipe Watson
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Re: Ulternative Player of the Season

Post by Snipe Watson »

Bart S wrote: Snipe whilst i understand the reasons why you may not rate Whitten and Steenson they have been important in Exter's relative success over the past few years. I am sure they would have done better than some of those we have kept or acquired in their positions and overall have improved Ulster's results and performances.
Steenson yes would have been an improvement on iHump and therefore an improvement. Whitten not so much.
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