BR wrote:You fall into the trap like so many before you, of only reading some of the words. The request is for assistance for Wade to crush rebellious scots (ie the revolting jacobites) - hardly surprising for a song sung in support of the monarch at a time of sedition. We can only assume that the music-hall patrons wished no ill-will on those loyal scots (many of whom made up Wade's own militia). I would also suggest that the verse wasn't 'taken out'. It seems to have been one of many verses, probably written by an array of people, which was used at that time, and not part of the version officailly recognised some years later. That may have been a reflection of Wade's failure to recreate past glories and failure to crush the aforementioned scots, or it may have been the irrelevance of a reference to a by-then historic event, or it may never have even been considered.
Furthermore I would wager every penny I own that less than 20% of the UK population know more than 1 verse of it,
I would suggest less than 10% and many of those would actually get the words wrong - as witnessed at countless sporting events over the years.
Lets take the last bit first, I would bid you as low as 1% and reckon none, other than possibly your goodself, would be word perfect
As for the rest, I will happily confirm that you are clearly a more diligent student of this than I. Despite my unusual admission of lack of expertise, I feel you "Disneyfied" part of your explanation, particularly "loyal Scots many of whom made up Wade's own militia." I have no doubt whatsoever that that would more accurately be termed hired Scottish mercenaries, for I am educated enough on the period to know that being a soldier was an escape from grinding poverty and the loyalty was to the wage package rather than the cause.
Further I maintain my assertion that both in Wales & Scotland it is not at all popular with the majority albeit the expression of that comes generally in the sporting arena. Scottish antipathy to their southern neighbours is legendary. So when half of the countries involved in the UK don't associate with the National Anthem & a third has a 40:60 or thereabouts split on it I maintain my assertion that it is not a song relevant as a representative anthem - it is simply too identified as being English.
NEVER MOVE ON. Years on, I cannot ever watch Ireland with anything but indifference, I continue to wish for the imminent death of Donal Spring, the FIRFUC's executioner of Wee Paddy & Wee Stu, and I hate the FIRFUCs with undiminished passion.
OneMore wrote: I would say that almost all of the Ulster players, for instance, would sing the soldier song if they actually knew the words.
OneMore, you have got that wrong, I doubt some of them would be happy singing it, and I do know some of them well enough to ask although never have done, I value my life
Really? Fair enough. Call me naive in that case.
Happy to be corrected. Anyone seen them at the twelfth recently? Just a thought.
BaggyTrousers wrote:I feel you "Disneyfied" part of your explanation, particularly "loyal Scots many of whom made up Wade's own militia." I have no doubt whatsoever that that would more accurately be termed hired Scottish mercenaries, for I am educated enough on the period to know that being a soldier was an escape from grinding poverty and the loyalty was to the wage package rather than the cause.
Having carried out the occassional piece of work for Walt's corporation, perhaps that is fair
However - I chose the word militia carefully. I'm sure Wade's troops in his continental battles contained a fair number of non-english (he was Irish himself IIRC) who could be classed as mercenaries if accept that the wars were solely an English endeavour. However I believe Wade was also instrumental in creating the Black Watch and other 'watches' who were loyal scots operating in Scotland, and would have included amongst their commanders, the clan leaders of old.
OneMore wrote: I would say that almost all of the Ulster players, for instance, would sing the soldier song if they actually knew the words.
OneMore, you have got that wrong, I doubt some of them would be happy singing it, and I do know some of them well enough to ask although never have done, I value my life
Really? Fair enough. Call me naive in that case.
Happy to be corrected. Anyone seen them at the twelfth recently? Just a thought.
The twelfth does not really have any bearing on the subject, plenty of unionists don't attend.
“That made me feel very special and underlined to me that Ulster is more than a team, it is a community and a rugby family" Rory Best
Snipe Watson wrote:It's not a discussion anyway, it's a non-discussion, pure uninformed speculation as nobody knows what the players think except themselves.
You seem a bit defensive there Snipe. Apologies if I have offended.
