D/L - Have you stopped to think why this "misconception" exists then, given that we only know your opinions on Ireland/DK through your postings on here? If Ireland were to win (and win well) this weekend, I can already see you saying that either England were terrible or that if it wasn't for DK we would have won a grand slam this year. Either way, I can't see you positing anything positive about ireland or in particular DK, regardless of the result. Now you may think I am being harsh on you here but to be honest, that's the way your postings come across sometimes.darkside lightside wrote:Brian - I think there's a misconception though, that I am consumed with hatred of DK and go all out to try to discredit him etc etc. I am not.brianc wrote:My "beef" with your argument is the obsession with manufacturing stats which show that DK is somehow to blame for all this, your last table is a good case in point.
As someone (Brian C I think?) said, many of us are not happy with some of the things around the Ireland team (tactics, selection on occasions) and Kidney should absolutely be accountable for that. However, similarly, there are things he has done well and deserves some credit for. With you, (rightly or wrongly) it comes across only one way and results in people like me feeling the need to defend Kidney more than I ordinarily would.
If I compare another poster who is not DK's biggest fan (Jackie Brown stand up!), he makes his point then moves onGives Ireland credit when things go well and stick when they don't, which is fair enough.
Should Ireland have won more over the past decade? Yes, probably and I think we are all disappointed with only 1 GS/championship during that period. Too many 2nd places, (which is still not bad compared to our international history overall).
Would a better coach have won more? Possibly, although I think the idea that we would have dominated the tournament over this period with any coach is simply not true. Not many people would criticise DK's handling of the 2009 GS winning side yet even that team had close matches against Eng and Sco IIRC, not to mention being a kick away from getting beaten in Cardiff. Why?? Because all the talk of the "golden generation" ignores the fact that the other memebrs of our XV were often distinctly average. In our GS matchday winning 22 we had TOL, Stringer, Horgan, Hayes, MOD, Court, DOC, P Wallace. That's more than 1/3 of the GS playing squad. Now no offence to any of them (indeed some great servants in there) but no-one would have them anywhere near their all time Irish XV's and most would have struggled to even make the other team's squads in 2009.
Finally, the whole successful club thing. Yes I can see the logic, but there's always more to it than meets the eye. Look at England's football for example compared to the success of Man U, Liverpool, Chelsea and Arsenal in the Champions League for a number of seasons. The gap is Partly explained by foreigners of course but also as above, the fact that some of the team members required to fill the team were not top level, despite the presence of Rooney, Gerrard, Scholes, Lampard etc. (eg no decent goalie for years).
In Ireland's case we also have to remember that the entire starting XV's during the glory period have virtually come from 2 provinces. It's been more spread out in England and Wales in particular, and even some of the Welsh guys have been playing in england or france, so it's not just 1 or 2 welsh clubs providing all the players. If your entire international team is coming from 2 teams then of course they are more likely to be successful, particularly when there isn't much between these teams at international level.
Finally, it's not just Ireland which fails to translate club success into 6 Nations success. Over the past decade, only once has the same country won the 6 Nations and Heineken Cup in the same year (2009 with Ireland and Leinster incidentally).
Anyway, now that I have joined the long and winding posts club I feel better! However as Baggy says, I do firmly believe that you are passionate about Ireland and want them to do well, as we all do...it's just that sometimes it comes across in a more negative fashion that you intend it to do so.