World Cup News

[Snipe Watson]

You'd think with a NZ-born coach, he'd want Ireland to play the SH style of rugby, but then when you have to answer to D4 big wigs, and have a pool of players who don't have that skillset your hands are tied.

The rugby skills of giving/taking a pass, stepping, tackling, kicking etc.. are not really all that complex. You will see that by watching good schools team. Irish players may need to tweak their skills a bit but it's no big deal.

Can't agree with that Spiffy
Irish players have as many skills as anyone else, but they are not as ingrained or as natural, meaning that they are less robust under pressure. It's one thing to look flash in the warm-up but looking flash under the pump is an entirely different prospect.

[BaggyTrousers]

You'd think with a NZ-born coach, he'd want Ireland to play the SH style of rugby, but then when you have to answer to D4 big wigs, and have a pool of players who don't have that skillset your hands are tied.

The rugby skills of giving/taking a pass, stepping, tackling, kicking etc.. are not really all that complex. You will see that by watching good schools team. Irish players may need to tweak their skills a bit but it's no big deal.

Can't agree with that Spiffy
Irish players have as many skills as anyone else, but they are not as ingrained or as natural, meaning that they are less robust under pressure. It's one thing to look flash in the warm-up but looking flash under the pump is an entirely different prospect.

You see Snipe, that last sentence says it all, this has been my point all along, you and others have talked of the phoney war, but if you aren't playing full on high class rugby regularly, it's just not there when you feel you actually need it.

You can try to see me off with tales of how Ireland haven't the players to come in when one or two break, but that doesn't cut it. You try to play quality rugby time after time if you want to compete with these teams of you settle for being turgid NH shyte, performing sporadically. If we don't try to play that rugby now, we are lost, never ever to come close.

To say we have a NZ coach and that is good enough is far from good enough. We have a very good coach who is coaching to keep his job, not necessarily to make us anything better than decent NH. Ireland's game is as limited as our back division. The pack can and do compete with most and don't lose out often , though aren't close to what NZ played for 70 minutes, the backs play a limited worthless game.

FibberJose, as we know, can do better, he has to ask more of our players.

[Snipe Watson]

I'm not really interested in getting into this again, the world cup is over and the phoney war was over before it started so it's really old hat.
Anyway there's as much as zero chance of you moving so I'm disinclined to waste my evening with such a futile exercise.

[Cap'n Grumpy]

Anyway there's as much as zero chance of you moving

So he's NOT moving to Spain then?

That's gonna disappoint a few around here

[Spiffsson]

I'm not really interested in getting into this again, the world cup is over and the phoney war was over before it started so it's really old hat.
Anyway there's as much as zero chance of you moving so I'm disinclined to waste my evening with such a futile exercise.

Ah c'mom Snipe. I'm sure that you have something up yer sleeve that you've been holding back!

[Snipe Watson]

I'm not really interested in getting into this again, the world cup is over and the phoney war was over before it started so it's really old hat.
Anyway there's as much as zero chance of you moving so I'm disinclined to waste my evening with such a futile exercise.

Ah c'mom Snipe. I'm sure that you have something up yer sleeve that you've been holding back!

Aye you can whistle for it too ye gowlbeg..................

[BaggyTrousers]

OK given such a pitiful response, I declare "checkmate".

The notion you can pick and chose when you play is now and always has been risible. I've bided my time, patiently awaiting, the denouement when all concerned can see how successful team go about their business shows the nonsense of the Irish approach.

Was it as good as we could be? Maybe so, maybe not but what has clearly been demonstrated is that double 6Ns champions means nothing in the wider scheme of things. Sure Ireland were colossally unlucky with the severity of injuries, but anyone thinking we'd have been at the races with any of the semi-finalists is kidding themselves.

We play an ultimately fruitless game that doesn't compete at top level, Fibber may or may not have got the best out of what he has. I think not, I think he has better players than the negative turgid play of the last two "great" 6Ns have shown.

All the things kept up sleeves turmed out to be either nonexistent or as yet unseen.

You are stripped bare Sniper but just can't admit it - and yes you are far from alone of course. Just a shame someone hasn't the balls to stand up and say, "Aye, your right, we were talking fûcking bollix".

Still turkeys and Christmas I suppose.

[Snipe Watson]

OK given such a pitiful response, I declare "checkmate".

The notion you can pick and chose when you play is now and always has been risible. I've bided my time, patiently awaiting, the denouement when all concerned can see how successful team go about their business shows the nonsense of the Irish approach.

Was it as good as we could be? Maybe so, maybe not but what has clearly been demonstrated is that double 6Ns champions means nothing in the wider scheme of things. Sure Ireland were colossally unlucky with the severity of injuries, but anyone thinking we'd have been at the races with any of the semi-finalists is kidding themselves.

We play an ultimately fruitless game that doesn't compete at top level, Fibber may or may not have got the best out of what he has. I think not, I think he has better players than the negative turgid play of the last two "great" 6Ns have shown.

All the things kept up sleeves turmed out to be either nonexistent or as yet unseen.

You are stripped bare Sniper but just can't admit it - and yes you are far from alone of course. Just a shame someone hasn't the balls to stand up and say, "Aye, your right, we were talking fûcking bollix".

Still turkeys and Christmas I suppose.

Harse manure !!

[Spiffsson]

OK given such a pitiful response, I declare "checkmate".

The notion you can pick and chose when you play is now and always has been risible. I've bided my time, patiently awaiting, the denouement when all concerned can see how successful team go about their business shows the nonsense of the Irish approach.

Was it as good as we could be? Maybe so, maybe not but what has clearly been demonstrated is that double 6Ns champions means nothing in the wider scheme of things. Sure Ireland were colossally unlucky with the severity of injuries, but anyone thinking we'd have been at the races with any of the semi-finalists is kidding themselves.

We play an ultimately fruitless game that doesn't compete at top level, Fibber may or may not have got the best out of what he has. I think not, I think he has better players than the negative turgid play of the last two "great" 6Ns have shown.

All the things kept up sleeves turmed out to be either nonexistent or as yet unseen.

You are stripped bare Sniper but just can't admit it - and yes you are far from alone of course. Just a shame someone hasn't the balls to stand up and say, "Aye, your right, we were talking fûcking bollix".

Still turkeys and Christmas I suppose.

Surely it's much too soon to say that Bags? Fibber is obviously holding back a few smart plays for the 2019 Rugby World Cup. You clearly do not understand the subtle nuances of modern Rugby Union, but will change yer tune when we walk off with the trophy in four year's time.

In Joe We Trust !!!!

Now, d'ye see thon yerd..................

[againstthehead]

Hansen admitted openly that they approached the group in a totally different way as in previous world cups where the all blacks got found out very quickly. I watched every game they played this season and their kicking game was virtually non existent up to semi finals. Semi final they expected the rush defence and kicked a lot of good ball away to get field position and pressurise the boks. Something unheard of in years gone past. Likewise they kicked a lot early doors v oz. They also competed a lot more at the breakdowns in the latter stages. Finally they also tried to use rolling malls albeit failed miserably.... Hansen guided the side magnificently. Summed up when he said they weren't there to retain the title but there to win it.

[bazzaj]

I think Baggy has echoed what I have been saying for about the last 4 years that 6 nations rugby is light years behind the championship.
Most people were exhilerated and rightly so by that tournament but I have to admit to feeling deflated by it all as it was all confirmed in the most predictable processional fashion.

1.The All Blacks are the best
2.South Africa and Australia are joint second and can catch them out the odd time.
3.Argentina are 4th
4.Ireland England and Wales are much of a muchness.
5.France are rubbish.

The only thing that has changed to any extent is Scotland seemed to have improved but they have had too many false dawns to get overly carried away by that.

I appreciate people thought the rugby in the world cup was fantastic but if you didn't watch SH rugby and just the European stuff you would say that.
When it comes to rugby I am hemispherical in my support as we need teams in Europe to close the gap on SH sides like England did in 2003.
As it stands thats the only time its happened and thats because Woodward prioritised the autumn internationals ahead of the 6 nations.
We need to start seeing the 6 nations as preparation for the World Cup and not treating every game as a win at all costs pressurised derby matches.

Sorry to appear so negative of late but to me if we don't start getting our heads out of the sand this gap is only going to widen.

[Russ]

I think Baggy has echoed what I have been saying for about the last 4 years that 6 nations rugby is light years behind the championship.
Most people were exhilerated and rightly so by that tournament but I have to admit to feeling deflated by it all as it was all confirmed in the most predictable processional fashion.

1.The All Blacks are the best
2.South Africa and Australia are joint second and can catch them out the odd time.
3.Argentina are 4th
4.Ireland England and Wales are much of a muchness.
5.France are rubbish.

The only thing that has changed to any extent is Scotland seemed to have improved but they have had too many false dawns to get overly carried away by that.

I appreciate people thought the rugby in the world cup was fantastic but if you didn't watch SH rugby and just the European stuff you would say that.
When it comes to rugby I am hemispherical in my support as we need teams in Europe to close the gap on SH sides like England did in 2003.
As it stands thats the only time its happened and thats because Woodward prioritised the autumn internationals ahead of the 6 nations.
We need to start seeing the 6 nations as preparation for the World Cup and not treating every game as a win at all costs pressurised derby matches.

Sorry to appear so negative of late but to me if we don't start getting our heads out of the sand this gap is only going to widen.

Can you imagine the outrage if we go out and try to play actual rugby but keep losing for 2 years?

[BaggyTrousers]

I think Baggy has echoed what I have been saying for about the last 4 years that 6 nations rugby is light years behind the championship.
Most people were exhilerated and rightly so by that tournament but I have to admit to feeling deflated by it all as it was all confirmed in the most predictable processional fashion.

1.The All Blacks are the best
2.South Africa and Australia are joint second and can catch them out the odd time.
3.Argentina are 4th
4.Ireland England and Wales are much of a muchness.
5.France are rubbish.

The only thing that has changed to any extent is Scotland seemed to have improved but they have had too many false dawns to get overly carried away by that.

I appreciate people thought the rugby in the world cup was fantastic but if you didn't watch SH rugby and just the European stuff you would say that.
When it comes to rugby I am hemispherical in my support as we need teams in Europe to close the gap on SH sides like England did in 2003.
As it stands thats the only time its happened and thats because Woodward prioritised the autumn internationals ahead of the 6 nations.
We need to start seeing the 6 nations as preparation for the World Cup and not treating every game as a win at all costs pressurised derby matches.

Sorry to appear so negative of late but to me if we don't start getting our heads out of the sand this gap is only going to widen.

Can you imagine the outrage if we go out and try to play actual rugby but keep losing for 2 years?

That young Russ, is both FibberJose's problem and his challenge. Does he want to use his still high stock amongst the fans, after all we only lost because of injuries , to try to shift our game upwards and onwards or will we continue to see us play for results in the minor leagues.

It's a genuine problem for him because there is no guarantee of success, he has lost his leader and according to many, me included, hasn't the playing resources to attempt "a NZ". It's very easy to see a situation where he attempts change, it doesn't work out in early seasons and he's dropped like a hot spud as a failure.

Look east beyond the Small part of England to England, there is a classic example of a coach trying to move from a stolid game of bosh to a more flowing style but when pressure comes on to get results in a home RWC, rips up his plan and plays a stultifyingly awful, talentless midfield to squeeze results - which didn't come - rather than play the style he aspired to, with those players likeliest to do so wearing nice suits as spectators. Lancaster has made some brave decisions, and he has had to live with his bosses denying him players playing elsewhere but ultimately he bottled his opportunity and may not get another.

He at least has something approaching the playing numbers that NZ and SA have in terms of decent professionals, Fibber of course has about 20% if that of their numbers.

It will be interesting to see how it unfolds.

[Jackie Brown]

I believe with players like Healy, McGrath, Cronin, Henderson, SOB, Heaslip, Sexton, Madigan, Jackson, McCloskey, Zebo, Earls, Gilroy, Payne (@ fullback), Cave and Olding if he's to come back as we hope. Then there are the youngsters Leinster are probably producing. We have the guys with the skills and abilities to play a more fluid attacking, offloading game. The 6N bores me to tears at present, yeah we've won it twice on points difference but that's not saying much considering how poor the opposition have been.

[bazzaj]

I thought our only hope in this world cup was that the penny had dropped on the last games of the season, where our sides were forced in to playing positive, attacking, risk free rugby as they were chasing scores.
Maybe therefore the bonus point system should be introduced but the onus should be on the coaches to change attitudes of players.

I think we have to look at the mindset of our sides rather than talking soley of offloading running open rugby.
Its all about introducing players to play with a positive mindset not a negative one.

For instance a kick can be a positive move if its like the one Ben Smith did late in the final for instance.
Any European player would have hoofed the ball straight out in those circumstances but Smiths positive mindset which they encourage in his set up, knew that a kick ahead would lead to a score and seal the game.

A kick to a corner where the opposition is forced to kick out under pressure is a positive play whereas a hoof down the middle of the pitch is negative.
It all comes from being too afraid to take the risk which is more mind over matter.

That is why I think people are genuinely confusing running the the ball as positive as opposed to kicking it as simply being negative.
That simply isn`t the case.
Murrays kick to Henshaw for a score against England was an example of how a kick can be positive.
However Wales pinging the ball around willy nilly against a 13 man Australia was an example of how moving the ball can be an negative as no one was taking responsiblity of doing anything positive in possession of the ball, to make a move that would break their defence.

We can change it as we have seen for one day and it starts with the traditional 6 nations bore fest being transformed into something approaching positive games played with intensity.