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Irish Unity

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How would you vote in a border poll?

Yes, to Irish Unity
17
59%
No, stay with England, Wales and Scotland
12
41%
 
Total votes : 29

Re: Irish Unity

Postby Cap'n Grumpy » Sat Mar 09, 2019 8:28 am

Rumn- Ireland can't have a common language with USA and GB - it has to be one or the other. :lol:

Unless ... shirley nat ... have USA and GB both an Irish language act? :duck:
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Re: Irish Unity

Postby promenader 2 » Sat Mar 09, 2019 11:45 am

moyletra wrote:Republic of Ireland has been a allegdedly net contributor because UK bailed them out from; 2008?

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Hardly a bail out. The UK lent Ireland money and has received £42m in interest every 6 months as a result.
https://www.irishtimes.com/business/eco ... -1.3053791
Much the same kind of arrangement the UK availed of 30 years earlier.
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Re: Irish Unity

Postby Marco » Sat Mar 09, 2019 12:02 pm

Here’s the thing, if I was given the choice between Johnston/Farage/May/Corbyn/Eton.... and Varadkar/Martin/Coveney/Miriam... then bring it on,Tiocfaidh ár lá! On the flip side, a choice between Attenborough/Churchill/Stalker... and Adams/O’Neill/Healy Rae/Wallace... then God Save Her Royal Highness, my liege! More seriously, I sincerely believe that a UI will happen and that it will be an accommodation of cultures that needs to happen, without the symbols, and I believe and want my now grown up children to vote for that. I’m not particularly proud to admit though that I, and I suspect many of my generation and background (South Fermanagh border prod), can never! The destruction of so many lives, friends and communities perpetrated by those of the same generation as I who would wish for a UI (and I’m not denying the wrongs by both sides), reminded for me in every visit to a parish cemetery in these parts, will take a generation to heal. Adams and Paisley, men of peace, as my good Munster friends would say, my proverbial a**e!!!
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Re: Irish Unity

Postby Dublin4 » Sat Mar 09, 2019 2:45 pm

Ireland became a net contributor to the EU in 2016. And in 2017 we got €1.8 billion from the EU and gave them €2.1 billion.

Government spending in 2018 was €61 billion so the EU factor is pretty small beer these days.
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Re: Irish Unity

Postby big mervyn » Sat Mar 09, 2019 2:52 pm

Dublin4 wrote:Ireland became a net contributor to the EU in 2016. And in 2017 we got €1.8 billion from the EU and gave them €2.1 billion.

Government spending in 2018 was €61 billion so the EU factor is pretty small beer these days.

Yeah. Sorry Pimp. 3 years. I had 2014 in my head for some reason.

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/ireland-s-contribution-to-eu-budget-expected-to-rise-to-2-7bn-this-year-1.3467403
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Re: Irish Unity

Postby Dave » Sat Mar 09, 2019 3:01 pm

Dublin4 wrote:Ireland became a net contributor to the EU in 2016. And in 2017 we got €1.8 billion from the EU and gave them €2.1 billion.

Government spending in 2018 was €61 billion so the EU factor is pretty small beer these days.
What's an extra 12 billion?
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Re: Irish Unity

Postby big mervyn » Sat Mar 09, 2019 3:19 pm

Dave wrote:
Dublin4 wrote:Ireland became a net contributor to the EU in 2016. And in 2017 we got €1.8 billion from the EU and gave them €2.1 billion.

Government spending in 2018 was €61 billion so the EU factor is pretty small beer these days.
What's an extra 12 billion?

England would probably bung them 12 billion per annum for a few years just to take the statelet of their hands. The current annual subsidy from the exchequer is almost exactly that!
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Re: Irish Unity

Postby solidarity » Sat Mar 09, 2019 4:13 pm

big mervyn wrote:
Dave wrote:
Dublin4 wrote:Ireland became a net contributor to the EU in 2016. And in 2017 we got €1.8 billion from the EU and gave them €2.1 billion.

Government spending in 2018 was €61 billion so the EU factor is pretty small beer these days.
What's an extra 12 billion?

England would probably bung them 12 billion per annum for a few years just to take the statelet of their hands. The current annual subsidy from the exchequer is almost exactly that!

And Dublin would pay Enland 12 billion to keep us.

Do you think the Yanks would be interested in a 51st state?
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Re: Irish Unity

Postby Rooster » Sat Mar 09, 2019 8:12 pm

Cap'n Grumpy wrote:
promenader 2 wrote:Why wouldn't we all be better off financially?

I don't know the answer to that, but it is much more than simply the business community etc would perform differently and other countries or EU would pump money in.

When it comes down to the nitty gritty, people tend to vote according to how it will affect themselves, not the community or the country.

Even if the country might prosper, a lot of people wont vote for that if their own personal tax is going to increase, if they are going to have to pay for or take out health insurance etc. (other considerations are available)

I am not aware of the arrangements south of the border, but it is information and disinformation like that which will influence how people vote.

Does anyone know of any honest politicians who will tell them the truth about exactly how a change in status will affect each person in the pocket?

No, I thought not ...
Personally I would be better off but there are a lot who wouldn't be.
The massive thing to sort out is pensions and healthcare which we have contributed to through National Insurance.
There are a serious number of civil servants who would either be out of work or else they would work on sub contracts to GB civil service. Then there all the retired ones pensions to sort.
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Re: Irish Unity

Postby rumncoke » Sun Mar 10, 2019 12:18 am

Contributing to the EU budget is not a positive and if and when GB the Irish may be required to contribute more to improve the roads etc in Greece and other East European States .




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Re: Irish Unity

Postby CIMANFOREVER » Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:47 am

nonplussed wrote:
Jackie Brown wrote:I would vote for a UI even if it cost me in the pocket. It would be worth it to be rid of the Conservatives and see the DUP squirm

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Re: Irish Unity

Postby CIMANFOREVER » Sun Mar 10, 2019 11:03 am

Marco wrote:Here’s the thing, if I was given the choice between Johnston/Farage/May/Corbyn/Eton.... and Varadkar/Martin/Coveney/Miriam... then bring it on,Tiocfaidh ár lá! On the flip side, a choice between Attenborough/Churchill/Stalker... and Adams/O’Neill/Healy Rae/Wallace... then God Save Her Royal Highness, my liege! More seriously, I sincerely believe that a UI will happen and that it will be an accommodation of cultures that needs to happen, without the symbols, and I believe and want my now grown up children to vote for that. I’m not particularly proud to admit though that I, and I suspect many of my generation and background (South Fermanagh border prod), can never! The destruction of so many lives, friends and communities perpetrated by those of the same generation as I who would wish for a UI (and I’m not denying the wrongs by both sides), reminded for me in every visit to a parish cemetery in these parts, will take a generation to heal. Adams and Paisley, men of peace, as my good Munster friends would say, my proverbial a**e!!!

To equate Paisley, fundamentalist Dinosaur ar*ehole that he was with trigger men, Mother and child murderers and war criminals is just ridiculous. Hutchinson, White, McDonald, Ervine etc are their moral equivalents not pseudo wannabe warrior spoofers like the DUP . People forget that, apart from in areas such as Fermanagh, North and West Belfast where a heavy price was paid to these men of peace. Lets not forget that. And thats why, some of you seem to be missing the point, people vote DUP or SF- they have raw memories of the damage done by both sets of paramilitaries against their communities. You think Shore Road or Ballysillan give a f*ck about fundamentalist 'Chins? They vote DUP to ensure NBelfast doesnt go to SF and that hypocrite Finucane. And TBH, being born and bred there I agree. With UUP dead and buried, sadly DUP is their only choice. No other reason. Give them an alternative and DUP would be history. Interesting the Loyalist political groups get the square root of fa votes however...
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Re: Irish Unity

Postby CIMANFOREVER » Sun Mar 10, 2019 11:32 am

Rooster wrote: Personally I would be better off but there are a lot who wouldn't be.
The massive thing to sort out is pensions and healthcare which we have contributed to through National Insurance.
There are a serious number of civil servants who would either be out of work or else they would work on sub contracts to GB civil service. Then there all the retired ones pensions to sort.

This is the known unknown. You can poll all you want ref how people will vote. When it comes to putting an X on the page for real, things change. Civil servants arent going to shoot themselves in the foot. Id say this is the most significant constituency if you take the Orange and Green voters as pretty much concrete. Only clarity around what happens in a transfer to UI would logically, if you were diposed, enable you to vote UI. Ditto their dependents. Otherwise why wouldnt you keep your sinecure as is? Its like Brexit in reverse. You hold what you have. Add in the history and politics and 50 + 1 becomes less clear imo.
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Re: Irish Unity

Postby rumncoke » Sun Mar 10, 2019 11:52 am

We will not forsake the blue sky’s of freedom for the grey mists of an Irish Republic if that be true then why jump into the black hole that is the European Union

The Union ?? Makes some sort of sense for Continental Counties with many common boarders but for the British Isles and especially Ireland out in the Atlantic Ocean the Island will be as remembered as Donegal is by Dublin — the crumbs from under the table .

The Swiss are surrounded by the EU without problems thus the problems being created for GB are those created by “. the spoiled Children” of the EU who are using the Irish to hinder agreement


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Re: Irish Unity

Postby Rooster » Sun Mar 10, 2019 2:06 pm

CIMANFOREVER wrote:
Rooster wrote: Personally I would be better off but there are a lot who wouldn't be.
The massive thing to sort out is pensions and healthcare which we have contributed to through National Insurance.
There are a serious number of civil servants who would either be out of work or else they would work on sub contracts to GB civil service. Then there all the retired ones pensions to sort.

This is the known unknown. You can poll all you want ref how people will vote. When it comes to putting an X on the page for real, things change. Civil servants arent going to shoot themselves in the foot. Id say this is the most significant constituency if you take the Orange and Green voters as pretty much concrete. Only clarity around what happens in a transfer to UI would logically, if you were diposed, enable you to vote UI. Ditto their dependents. Otherwise why wouldnt you keep your sinecure as is? Its like Brexit in reverse. You hold what you have. Add in the history and politics and 50 + 1 becomes less clear imo.
Yet the press and political commentators all push the orange and green divide, this one is not an orange and green divide though for anyone with anything in the space between their ears, extremists will still follow that split but it is the vastly greater number of moderates who will decide a referendum and a lot wont conform to the orange and green divide.
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