Schools Cup 2010

[AndyB]

I agree with you in part RHH. As I said I have watched my son play for the last 6 years and I have made my policy not to shout and scream from touchlines at anyone on the pitch, players or referees. I will applaud good play from either side.
I too am embarrassed by certain parents (not just dads I may add) shouting at referees. These people really do need to wise up.

Having said that, I have witnessed some shockingly biased displays of refereeing at various schools over the years. This sort of refereeing can lead to enormous frustration for the players and when kids get frustrated their discipline can go which is sad.

Parents and biased refs need to realise that the point of an under 14B match is not to win at all costs but to get 30+ boys out on a rugby field learning to play the game and enjoying themselves.

Too many dads and teachers are on an ego trip based on their sons/pupils winning matches.

All that is not to take away from the many many teachers throughout Ireland who give their time to the schoolboy boy, without whom we would be in dire straits.

[Bruce]

The thread is schools cup 2010 for heaven's sake,how has it descended to this ?

Suggestion to the pastieman is to set up another thread where he can rant himself blue in the face.

Neutral refs for schools cup so hopefully by the time junior gets there the problem will have solved itself.

[cables]

I too am embarrassed by certain parents (not just dads I may add) shouting at referees.

I know Andy. About 15 years ago, I took Cordelia to a Schools Cup game v Methody. Our son was playing. Cordelia would be much more competitive and vocal than me. I was embarrassed too. Now it would be fair to say that she was not the only mother who was way OTT that day.

Thankfully she will be on a zimmer frame or perhaps in Forest Lawns before our grandson gets near a schools cup team.

[AndyB]

I too am embarrassed by certain parents (not just dads I may add) shouting at referees.

I know Andy. About 15 years ago, I took Cordelia to a Schools Cup game v Methody. Our son was playing. Cordelia would be much more competitive and vocal than me. I was embarrassed too. Now it would be fair to say that she was not the only mother who was way OTT that day.

Thankfully she will be on a zimmer frame or perhaps in Forest Lawns before our grandson gets near a schools cup team.

Mothers shouldn't be allowed any near rugby pitches.

[bogboy]

Schools rugby is a game and basically the complaints about refs show to a degree why much of the enjoyment which should come from the game is lost

Everybody takes it so seriously

Coaches Parents pupils and refs the result is everything

MCB success in the Schools Cup is basically the numbers game --search for and make a big pack of forwards get them fit drill them in the basics and deny the oppossition the ball .

Likewise at Methody there is tradition which becomes in built as pupils go through school and motivates them once they leave school that sense of purpose is lost and therefore the desire to play after school is often lost as well.

Most of the other schools send out XV players but of those 15 at least 2-3 will be a year or more immature than players on the Methody team either in age or size and they will also have at least one maybe two who are making up the numbers like a winger who can't catch a ball a centre who can't tackle a prop who can't run and waddles from set piece to set piece ie passangers.

[AndyB]

MCB success in the Schools Cup is basically the numbers game --search for and make a big pack of forwards get them fit drill them in the basics and deny the oppossition the ball .

May I just point that while MCB does have a large number of pupils, half of them are in fact girls. Both Inst and Campbell have more potential rugby players (i.e. boys) in the school so MCB's success relative to those schools can't all be about numbers.

[Beattiespastie]

Apologies for the rant RED HAND and to some degree you have a point but in other ways you are off the mark as well. As I pointed out I am NOT the ranting parent type but on that day in question I was amongst many who got a tad upset for whatever reason ( and I dont feel clever about it either) but as a parent I would argue its only natural to feel a little aggrieved at times.I have been to many games at school level and I would say that at nearly all those games you have a large number of parents egging on their kids with encouragement AND giving the ref a tickle when he got it wrong...anyone who says otherwise has had the earmuffs on or hasnt had a kid play for a big rugby school.
I would agree that some parents step well wide of the mark but most parents have a positive imput at schoolboy level.I remember playing football for my school back in the days when everthing was in black and white and some of the parents at those games back then needed locking up!.....

[Beattiespastie]

RED HAND.....just re-read your last post in which you were having a pop at me and I would agree with what you said about the committment of teachers in their roles as coaches,mentors and role models. I was AMAZED at the hours put in by Davy Wells in my sons first year at Methody.Rain,hail or shine and the man was there . I was amused at stories from previous years which spoke of how Mr Wells used a golfing cart to coach from when he suffered a leg injury..myth or not I could honestly say that the wee man is a superb role model to the kids and his coaching is second to none.
Incidently I dont think ANY game between RBAI and MCB is a trivial matter to those concerned but the wonderful thing is that a couple of hours after hammering each other on the pitch for 60 mins they are laughing and messing about on their XBOX 360s taking the mikey talking about the game and thats all that matters....the game is about the fun of playing but like it or not kids these days ,like their coaches and parents like the idea of winning as well.

[bogboy]

I notice you talk of Inst and Campbell having the same numbers it is also equally true that those schools have nearly the same amount of success as MCB and it is a rare year when none of them is in the final.

But the same lack of after school success of the players is also evident

Because the school success is based as I say on numbers/size and the motivation of the schools Tradition and once the latter is removed the players drift from the game.

[Beattiespastie]

I couldnt agree more Bogboy...Belfast schools traditionally dominate the schools cup but once the upper sixth school run is over its decision time for those young lads and more often than not rugby falls by the wayside. Maybe the likes of INST,MCB and CAMPBELL are too preoccupied in securing supremecy over each other and once the cup run is over the impetus and motivation goes?

[Cap'n Grumpy]

that's not the issue that's raised here though. yes, school's rugby a bit of a tribal thing - there's your team blah blah, plus everyone hates inst and methody cos they win the bloody thing every year.

but the issue being raised above is the lack of players going on to play rugby as a career from these schools, particularly MCB. are they getting over-coached to the point that by the end of 6th form they've simply had enough of the game? eg compare to blackrock for instance - why are they churning out more players who go on to leinster and irish level than methody, who could arguably be put on at least a par with blackrock

A high proportion of methody pupils go on to further education across the water where they discover a "new life". Some may continue to play rugby, some may even come back to play rugby.

Could it be that Blackrock feeds into local Dublin teams, and a high proportion go into further education at UCD, Trinity etc, ie still within Ireland, and possibly find it easier to still fit into the rugby scene nearer home?

I don't know - just a suggestion.

[Cap'n Grumpy]

MCB success in the Schools Cup is basically the numbers game --search for and make a big pack of forwards get them fit drill them in the basics and deny the oppossition the ball .

May I just point that while MCB does have a large number of pupils, half of them are in fact girls. Both Inst and Campbell have more potential rugby players (i.e. boys) in the school so MCB's success relative to those schools can't all be about numbers.

They also cover more sports than most schools, so a lot of their potential players could be lost to the likes of rowing etc

[cables]

Both Inst and Campbell have more potential rugby players (i.e. boys) in the school so MCB's success relative to those schools can't all be about numbers.

How should one measure relative success? Is it the number of times a School gets it's name on the Trophy?

[Instonian]

still didnt help against castleknock

[pwrmoore]

Grumpy - did you just fix your fixing?