Where did it all go wrong?

[scrum5]

On Logie's first appearance at the URSC AGM way back in the day when it was held at Newforge and you were a cert to win in the ballot as there were more prizes in attendance than supporters Logie said that Ulster would be best in the world, it was garbage then and it's garbage now, Cables tore strips of him about some inaccuracies he was spouting and Logie shrugged his shoulders and went off on another tangent.... the conclusion was that we'd settle for Ulster being the best team in Ireland and that our new CEO was a spoffer, 7 years later we're probably the 4th best team in Ireland and Logie is still spoffing.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_u ... 518675.stm

[Cockatrice]

Grumps, I continue to believe that your report of Fit's words and the general mis/conception of what he has said are much the same, indeed, it fits into such a minute "ballpark of dis-ambiguity" (I believe I may have coined that, must google it, feel free to bring it into common usage. ) that you could roll it up and store it inside a matchbox.

That apart I agree with much of what you say and I too would determine coaching & the internecine warfare that has been part of that scene for a long time as main reasons we are a shambles. However, I'm sure the whole House will agree with me that it is not unreasonable to say that Fit could not possibly have been unaware of that strife and has turned his blind eye to it for far too long. For a CEO to allow such nonsense to fester under his nose is entirely unacceptable in any shape or form, it hints to me at an act of cowardice, not doing his job in sorting out a key area of the business he is charged with making flourish.

Anyone with a conscience would resign.

It makes you understand why so many of his business interests went down the pan and by that I mean the local ones less referenced by Walter Mitty. In some countries lying on a CV is a criminal offence... Baggy as you say any CEO worth his salt would have done something more than close his eyes or bring the players and staff in for a sermon on the mount. He may not be the only problem he may not be the biggest but he a significant ant part of the problem... And to think the only thing that concerns him now and for past year is his membership of the 2023 Ireland RWC bid..

[Snipe Watson]

Grumps, I continue to believe that your report of Fit's words and the general mis/conception of what he has said are much the same, indeed, it fits into such a minute "ballpark of dis-ambiguity" (I believe I may have coined that, must google it, feel free to bring it into common usage. ) that you could roll it up and store it inside a matchbox.

That apart I agree with much of what you say and I too would determine coaching & the internecine warfare that has been part of that scene for a long time as main reasons we are a shambles. However, I'm sure the whole House will agree with me that it is not unreasonable to say that Fit could not possibly have been unaware of that strife and has turned his blind eye to it for far too long. For a CEO to allow such nonsense to fester under his nose is entirely unacceptable in any shape or form, it hints to me at an act of cowardice, not doing his job in sorting out a key area of the business he is charged with making flourish.

Anyone with a conscience would resign.

It makes you understand why so many of his business interests went down the pan and by that I mean the local ones less referenced by Walter Mitty. In some countries lying on a CV is a criminal offence... Baggy as you say any CEO worth his salt would have done something more than close his eyes or bring the players and staff in for a sermon on the mount. He may not be the only problem he may not be the biggest but he a significant ant part of the problem... And to think the only thing that concerns him now and for past year is his membership of the 2023 Ireland RWC bid..

Jeepers Cockers, you really do hate him, don't you?

[Gerald the Mole]

On Logie's first appearance at the URSC AGM way back in the day when it was held at Newforge and you were a cert to win in the ballot as there were more prizes in attendance than supporters Logie said that Ulster would be best in the world, it was garbage then and it's garbage now, Cables tore strips of him about some inaccuracies he was spouting and Logie shrugged his shoulders and went off on another tangent.... the conclusion was that we'd settle for Ulster being the best team in Ireland and that our new CEO was a spoffer, 7 years later we're probably the 4th best team in Ireland and Logie is still spoffing.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_u ... 518675.stm

The good captain must have missed that AGM

[scrum5]

Cables didn't miss Logie

[UlsterNo9]

Sure wouldn't it be great if Logie was a part of us hosting the Rugby World Cup.

Imagine the premiere tournament of our sport on our doorstep.

[Cap'n Grumpy]

On Logie's first appearance at the URSC AGM way back in the day when it was held at Newforge and you were a cert to win in the ballot as there were more prizes in attendance than supporters Logie said that Ulster would be best in the world, it was garbage then and it's garbage now, Cables tore strips of him about some inaccuracies he was spouting and Logie shrugged his shoulders and went off on another tangent.... the conclusion was that we'd settle for Ulster being the best team in Ireland and that our new CEO was a spoffer, 7 years later we're probably the 4th best team in Ireland and Logie is still spoffing.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_u ... 518675.stm

The good captain must have missed that AGM

Don't know about a good captain, but this Cap'n didn't.

Indeed I have just looked at photos I took and listened to a recording of the CEO speaking at that very event ....including cables taking him to task.

Some good facts there Scrum ..... and a few alternative facts thrown in for good measure.

There were approx 50 people there and 4 ballot prizes ,but hey, who's counting?

Back to the main theme.the CEO outlined the position of the pro game and the amateur game at the time and described it as unacceptable.From his description of the situation at that time, we have gone backwards - ergo by his own standards, where we are now is unacceptable. (we had one team in top div of AILthen and that needed to increase -it hasn't, it's gone backwards. We needed to increase the adult playing base - likewise backwards.

The recording confirmed my memory (including the foothills analogy) that he did not claim we would be the best, but that we should be "the best we can be". His target was to be fully at the top table of world rugby in (and I quote) 8,10, or possibly 12 years. His shorter term "staging posts" were an ERC quarter final within the next 1-2 years (achieved - made it to final within 2 years but gone backwards since), top 4 in league with 3-4 years (achieved but gone backwards since), on route to winning another European cup (not achieved).

He spoke about developing the new stadium - achieved (perhaps not to some people's liking), but what was delivered was way beyond what had been envisaged by MR. He talked about increasing financial turnover which I presume has been achieved, and he talked about profitability, which I think was achieved initially, but now looks like going backwards. He also talked about better training facilities (probably at Ravenhill) which have also been achieved.

All in all, some of his early "staging posts" were achieved, but we look as far away as ever in getting a sniff at the rest.

On Cables taking him to task,the CEO claimed that Ulster were (then) ranked 12th in Europe.Cables corrected that to 24th. SL tried to explain how the ranking was carried out, but got some detail wrong and again cables corrected him. after being initially flustered, he accepted cables version and welcomed being corrected.

He did state that he would and should be accountable to the Ulster supporters and would welcome criticism and suggestions.I guess he must be really happy now then as he's getting what he welcomed.

[scrum5]

Cap'n, that night was a massive turn out compared to previous URSC events I miss the sausage rolls and sandwiches now but more importantly Cables is missed considerably more, I don't think I've laughed as much when Cables took Logie to task

[Cap'n Grumpy]

Cap'n, that night was a massive turn out compared to previous URSC events I miss the sausage rolls and sandwiches now but more importantly Cables is missed considerably more, I don't think I've laughed as much when Cables took Logie to task

It was a massive turnout compared to previous -probably because Shane Logan, David Humphreys and Brian McLaughlin came to speak. That would have been unheard of under Mike Reid. At one point after Cables had corrected Shane's assertion that Ulster were ranked 12th,he tried to move on by saying "I don't understand the question you are asking,but i will take questions later. Cables firmly but politely stated,"I'm not asking a question,I'm correcting your mistake"

To be fair to SL, he didn't shrug his shoulders and go off on a tangent as you suggested, but made the mistake of trying to explain to cables how the rankings were worked out, (while accepting his correction), but once again cables had to correct him on the formula over the previous 30 matches weighted in favour of the most recent (SL had suggested 24 matches and didn't mention the weighting). Whilst initially flummoxed, he did accept the correction and then moved on.

You are correct that cables is still sorely missed - coming up on another anniversary very soon. It matters not a lot, but for what it's worth, SL was also upset at Cables' demise and remembered him (and his correction) surprisingly fondly when he heard of his death. I think he recognised that cables was someone who loved ulster and also liked accuracy. He got that right, anyway.

[exile-fer-now]

[quote="BaggyTrousers"]

..........That apart I agree with much of what you say and I too would determine coaching & the internecine warfare that has been part of that scene for a long time as main reasons we are a shambles. However, I'm sure the whole House will agree with me that it is not unreasonable to say that Fit could not possibly have been unaware of that strife and has turned his blind eye to it for far too long. For a CEO to allow such nonsense to fester under his nose

.......... & not back his Head Coach ? Why give Doak the job and not let him do it ? Was Doak too popular/respected by the players ? Was Kiss just power hungry or tactical ? Or did the CEO just bottle it ? Why do we never learn our lessons - read Brian McLaughlin/Mark McCall ?

If Champions Cup final/semi-finals were failures ...... I'd take failures with an Ulster team that cares every time. Rather that than being led by a power crazed wee mercenary who is only concerned with his own reputation.

[BaggyTrousers]

Sure wouldn't it be great if Logie was a part of us hosting the Rugby World Cup.

Imagine the premiere tournament of our sport on our doorstep.

Ireland is a pygmy nation with an appalling lack of suitably sized rugby stadia. Playing matches on GAA pitches is an utter nonsense. Spain on the other hand ...................... no wait, too small.

[Gerald the Mole]

" Best in the world bar none"

http://www.niassembly.gov.uk/assembly-b ... ter-rugby/

[Snipe Watson]

" Best in the world bar none"

http://www.niassembly.gov.uk/assembly-b ... ter-rugby/

hard to argue with Hansard Ger.

[Cockatrice]

Taping meetings... Feck me was it at the White House.

[Cockatrice]

" Best in the world bar none"

http://www.niassembly.gov.uk/assembly-b ... ter-rugby/

hold UR accountable..