Ulster Rugby - driven into the ground

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stickinout
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Re: Ulster Rugby - driven into the ground

Post by stickinout » Mon Apr 19, 2010 12:22 pm

mikerob wrote:
stickinout wrote:
If the 15 k is to be viewed as an intermediate point, what in your opinion needs to be the final destination?
My gut feel is that if UR had access to a 20-something K stadium like Munster, Cardiff, Os etc. we would be in a great position. That means about 15k of good seats and 10k of poor seats at the ends.

As I said, its all theoretical and stadium discussions come around regular as clockwork on this site with very little really new being discussed.

MR do you think this is possible at Ravenhill for the long term or are you hoping like FB that the national stadium will be built? 5 k end stands sounds like a bridge too far with the amount of space we have. Maybe if the stadium is totally realigned, we scrap the blazers car park and buy some land off the school at the back...... I agree with you about watching a game from the end, not the best but sometimes it's worth it if you see a massive side step or a fancy backs move coming off and ending with a try.

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Re: Ulster Rugby - driven into the ground

Post by mikerob » Mon Apr 19, 2010 1:23 pm

You're asking the wrong person when it comes to planning & building issues OR what the Stormont muppet show may come up with!

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Re: Ulster Rugby - driven into the ground

Post by pwrmoore » Mon Apr 19, 2010 1:55 pm

stickinout wrote: Does anybody know if Munster have any further building plans for Thomond to increase capacity? i would imagine their next step would be to build another huge stand to match the one they've already got, or is that not on the cards?
:scratch: :scratch: I Haven't been there yet but from the pictures I have seen the "New Thomond" already has a huge stand down EACH side of the ground.
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Re: Ulster Rugby - driven into the ground

Post by pwrmoore » Mon Apr 19, 2010 1:57 pm

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Paul.

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Re: Ulster Rugby - driven into the ground

Post by WhiteKnightoftheWeld » Mon Apr 19, 2010 2:02 pm

Nice to see a thread with the word 'ground' in its title transforming itself into a stadium debate.

I'd suggest using Casement Park for big games - with football looking to spruce up Windsor a national stadium isn't likely to be firmly sought by any of the 'interested' parties. 32k capacity, keeps things in Belfast, pitch is certainly big enough.
Could set up a park 'n' ride on the Boucher Road. Could/would be a fantastic endeavour for cross-community relations.

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Re: Ulster Rugby - driven into the ground

Post by WhiteKnightoftheWeld » Mon Apr 19, 2010 2:07 pm

pwrmoore wrote:
stickinout wrote: Does anybody know if Munster have any further building plans for Thomond to increase capacity? i would imagine their next step would be to build another huge stand to match the one they've already got, or is that not on the cards?
:scratch: :scratch: I Haven't been there yet but from the pictures I have seen the "New Thomond" already has a huge stand down EACH side of the ground.
U would be looking at a stand being placed at one/both ends of the ground. As it stands there is terracing there already. I'd think that there would not be sufficient room at the road end of the ground, perhaps if they buy more housing and level the place around as they did before they'd be able to do this...

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Re: Ulster Rugby - driven into the ground

Post by UlsterManiac » Mon Apr 19, 2010 3:35 pm

WhiteKnightoftheWeld wrote: As it stands there is terracing there already.
Was that a deliberate use of the word 'stands' following on from your earlier post on the use of the word 'ground' ??!!

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Re: Ulster Rugby - driven into the ground

Post by brianc » Mon Apr 19, 2010 4:10 pm

For all you weirdos out there the attached link lists the world's stadia by capacity :shock: . Biggest are mostly US college grounds, Croker comes a very respectable 32nd on the list.

Also interesting to note that it is estimated that the Circus Maximus of ancient Rome could hold 270,000 spectators. Given our recent performances a circus ring might be appropriate, however I doubt even the undeniable genius of the UR marketing machine could fill this.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_st ... y_capacity

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Re: Ulster Rugby - driven into the ground

Post by Gary » Mon Apr 19, 2010 4:31 pm

The way we're playing at the moment we'll soon need a stadium for about 150 people. Think we need to sort the team out first :(
I have a cunning plan...why not just leave things as they are but tell the Brexiteers that we have left the EU? After all they believe every lie that they were told by Boris and Nigel.

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Re: Ulster Rugby - driven into the ground

Post by Freddie Benson » Mon Apr 19, 2010 4:45 pm

stickinout wrote: MR do you think this is possible at Ravenhill for the long term or are you hoping like FB that the national stadium will be built?
small point in the grand scheme of things, but I'm not in favour of national stadium and never have been. I would be in favour of a rebuilt Ravenhill with increased capacity (c15k) as has been suggested. As that previously had been objected to by residents and planning seemed unlikely, I did think that either the Titanic or Ormeau Park 25k options were next best.
No longer the Celtic League winning coach

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Re: Ulster Rugby - driven into the ground

Post by nonplussed » Mon Apr 19, 2010 6:25 pm

15k @ ravenhill within 3 years is the plan, and i believe it!

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Re: Ulster Rugby - driven into the ground

Post by promsandwich » Mon Apr 19, 2010 6:46 pm

A 15K stadium is more than sufficient for Ulster, particularly if the redevelopment of the "old stand" incorporates corporate facilities which is where a lot of money is made. However the notional capacity/corporate income is reasonably irrelevant because:

1. Until the team improves significantly ( and by that I mean has the ability to finish in the top 4 regularly and get past the group stage of the HEC ) we will not attract crowds of 12.5K or greater on a weeekly basis. The only games this season can I can recall feeling bunged ( I am unaware if figures support this ) were the HEC games and the interpros. This IMHO is unlikely to change until the team improves.

2. We are in a recession. If we weren't fat cat businesses would have snapped up all the boxes and corporate seats a long time ago. Until the general economy improves the only thing further corporate boxes/seats would provide is more glaring empty spaces.

Therefore all current focus has to be on improving the performances on the pitch to the level were we are competing at the top end of the ML and progressing in HEC. Until that happens it seems to me that attendances will remain at or about the 7500 to 9000 mark, interpros and HEC excepted.

Please please please sign a quality 9,10,15 and a second row of reasonable quality to replace Ed.

Please install pride in our jersey - if necessary make our squad watch a video of Munster A against Connacht to demonstrate the meaning of playing for the jersey.

Finally, all our players should be reminded that the season does not end at Christmas.

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Re: Ulster Rugby - driven into the ground

Post by Neil F » Mon Apr 19, 2010 7:20 pm

Prom; I think this whole thing has something of chicken and egg about it; where is the money going to come from to buy the players who will improve things on the park if Ulster don't have it at the minute? I wonder if the cash that will build any new stadium on the Ravenhill site is enough Ulster's that it could be spent on improving the squad? I sincerely doubt it. It is sustainable to borrow money to build a vastly improved stadium; it is not sustainable to borrow money to buy in the players it is perceived that we are missing. One will benefit the side in the long-run, the other will be a short-term solution to a problem that, in part, has been something cyclical.

A larger stadium, with better facilities and permanent, covered bars, food stalls and a club shop is desirable, even if average attendance does not increase. I'd drink much more on my scant visits to Ravenhill if it didn't take so bloody long in the beer tent at times, or if it was just, generally, nicer; it might be enough to encourage me to show up an hour before kick off and put on my beer coat, as opposed to putting it on long before I arrive at the stadium. These things have to be factored in - I know it has a bit of, "if they build it they will come"s about it but one of the aims of UR must be to get fans spending more money when they are actually inside Ravenhill. Better facilities will encourage this.

In the long-run, a bigger, better stadium that could well be the biggest and best we could fit onto the Ravenhill site should not be seen to be a bad thing - a compromise, perhaps but still probably in the best interests of UR. To be a competitive team, on the park and financially, Ulster don't necessarily need the biggest and best. At least not just yet. Bigger and better is good enough, at least for a little while.

Those advocating a move from Ravenhill - what makes you think that the sale of Ravenhill and the legal costs associated with the sale of that ground and purchase of new land in a comparable site in Belfast would balance out financially?

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Re: Ulster Rugby - driven into the ground

Post by Cossax » Mon Apr 19, 2010 7:46 pm

WhiteKnightoftheWeld wrote:
pwrmoore wrote:
stickinout wrote: Does anybody know if Munster have any further building plans for Thomond to increase capacity? i would imagine their next step would be to build another huge stand to match the one they've already got, or is that not on the cards?
:scratch: :scratch: I Haven't been there yet but from the pictures I have seen the "New Thomond" already has a huge stand down EACH side of the ground.
U would be looking at a stand being placed at one/both ends of the ground. As it stands there is terracing there already. I'd think that there would not be sufficient room at the road end of the ground, perhaps if they buy more housing and level the place around as they did before they'd be able to do this...

Image
Munster's more immediate concern is with redeveloping Musgrave Park from ~7.5k to 18-22k. That way Munster aren't losing out so much by playing games in Cork and there will probably be less pressure to play all the big games in TP.

TP isn't very far from being debt free, or that was my understanding anyways, so future development of the North and South sides of the ground will probably be possible from a financial perspective but there's a space issue - more houses would have to be bought on the North side and the South side is by a road so there may be limited scope for building there.

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Re: Ulster Rugby - driven into the ground

Post by Neil F » Mon Apr 19, 2010 8:00 pm

YoungMan wrote:Neil.................Why would UR sell something they do not own? do you ever pay attention ....
Wasn't aware that I implied that UR could or would be selling anything.

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