ENOUGHS ENOUGH!

[fermain]

Gentlemen, this has become a good and interesting debate, however there is no need to use childish name calling as part of your arguements. I hear this type of thing on the playground all the time, and it does not become anyone who lowers themselves to it. For the record I am also moving this post to the 'G'wan and ask away forum', as it's more to do with the business of the URSC.

fermain

[Cockatrice]

fermain - accept that but for info re my last post on running cost I have opened thread on View frae thae Hill as it is interesting in its own right.

[fermain]

s'ok, that ones about Ulster rugby.

[LePaul]

Thanks OAWUF - I'll keep my response brief - as you and Gary wish to make this a slanging match.

All I have ever set out to achieve was the actual truth and the actual facts and it appears that there is a great problem getting them rather than someone elses interpretation of them.

AS for my relationships with anyone on this Forum - thats my business. It is normal practice among folk on the internet - a kind of code of practice - to leave peoples real lives out - sadly this seems to have been binned in here. Pity - it'll put decent folk of getting involved.

As for Mr Reid - nothing for me has changed with regard to him and his position concerning URSC. I think there is enough info out there to support this - I guess more will continue to trickle out from time to time - usually does.

As for facts - may I suggest that you read my posts - I have said little about anyone - save Mr Reid - and have never slagged off the URSC - its committee at any stage. Nor will I. I am sad to see what has happened to all the good work and effort that was put in by the originators - their good intentions and the awful manner in which things have turned out.

As for calling me the things you have called me - carry on my son I'm a big lad too.

[ballpark]

What a plonker BP. you're really beginning to look stupid you know, Le Paul asked a question and I answered it . CT told me both verbally and by e-mail - I'm sure you would disagree with my posting that e-mail. So go back to those windmills - they're waiting for you.Bye-bye old bean.

I may be a plonker Gary (who cares?), but you are increasingly sounding like Dr. No's demented wee brother. Now why don't you climb off your horse and stop talking down to posters on this forum with all this, 'I 'know' because I was on a committee and you weren't, therefore your wrong' stuff. that fails to acknowledge any other posters point of view.

The following, whilst not touting it as the holy mojo of truth because i can't verify it, is similar in tone and content to what i heard on the Nolan Radio show.

Transcript
“We did a survey of our supporters on our website”

“Well we only have a thousand members so I suppose it is not too bad from a representative point of view of the Ulster Rugby Supporters’ Club.”

"Gary
I don't need to have heard the show to know that he wasn't , as has been confirmed by just about everybody who did hear the show who have said that he never mentioned the URSC. Maybe you heard something different, but I'm happy to listen to the majority rather than you."

Your response simply highlights the arrogance which is blighting any chance of reasonable debate here and fails to acknowledge any alternative viewpoint to your own. The committee may not think Stanley was representing them but if the transcript is to be believed Stanley clearly believed he was representing the supporters club. That much should be acknowledged and flies in the face of the e-mail statement from the URSC to another contributor to this site which claimed Stanley was not representing the URSC. If he was merely representing himself as is claimed by the URSC why has he apologised to the committee as appeared to be the case in the statement that was issued to a contributor to this site.

[OAWUF]

Le paul:

Slanging match? - I'm way to far into this thread to be accused of STARTING a slanging match.

Your looking for the actual truth? - You haven't asked any questions - you have repeatedly given your version of the truth and slamed anyone who has tried to offer an alternative.

As for taking the high moral ground Le Paul:

I haven't put anything out into the public arena that isn't alrady there. If you remember you and Ballpark had a little 'love in' a while back discussing his wonderful trip to see his mate Le Paul etc. etc. etc.

As for facts: I haven't actually called you anything (apart from a 'contributor') whereas you called gary childish and naive and as for MR there's too many to name but 'fat boy' and his 'goons' will give a flavour of your name calling!!!

Hypocrite!

ps Le Paul:

Are you willing to take on a semi full time role and front up the URSC, take time to organise, submit formal written proposals to committee of how the URSC should progress, meet with MR and his 'goons' to promote you arguments and convince UR that URSC is worth everyone's time and efforts.

Or are you ready to take on the challange of a fully independent URSC and steer that particular ship?????

Don't think so!!

[Kofi Annan]

Hey Guys Kool it, lets all think of a way forward from this mess, Gary and CT have tried and not through their fault have they failed, they have been pro active and have put a lot more effort in than others, but the past is now the past,lets embrace 2006 and move forward together as one big happy union, let put all this unneccessary bickering and oneupmanship to the side WELL DONE CT WELL DONE GARY.Now lets move on or


I will send in some American peacekeepers then we are rubber ducked!

[dead ball]

KOFI

Go and help some people who care what you think. No doubt BP will be telling his mates he talks directly to Kofi Annan since he now posts regularly.

[Cockatrice]

In truth the total number of votes cast on this issue sort of sums up the interest that members have about any club matter.

Now don't take that the wrong way it is a simple fact that of nearly 1,000 members albeit it is a fact that most do not use either site only 14 votes have been accounted.

Now if we used spin we could show that this vote showed strong support for an independent club but unfortunately others would see through it.

[ballpark]

Le paul:ps Le Paul:

Are you willing to take on a semi full time role and front up the URSC, take time to organise, submit formal written proposals to committee of how the URSC should progress, meet with MR and his 'goons' to promote you arguments and convince UR that URSC is worth everyone's time and efforts.

Or are you ready to take on the challange of a fully independent URSC and steer that particular ship?????

Don't think so!!

Are you willing to do that OAWUF?? Don't recall you ever actually saying you do anything associated with Ulster Rugby or it's supporters club, just keep hearing you bawling out others with demands for total loyalty to Mark McCall and the Ulster team.

BTW: CT I didn't submit a vote because I didn't think it was a serious attempt at a poll.

[pwrmoore]

I didn't vote either CT...

I'm in favour of an Ulster Rugby Supporters club. If that can be done effectively under the wing of UR - without unwarranted interference in its affairs by UR - then that would be my preference . If not then I'm prepared for independence.

I do feel guilty that in either case I'm prepared to let others carry the weight of running the club and putting little in myself whilst enjoying the benefits of the excellent supporters evenings and the trip to Leinster. For that reason I don't feel in a strong position to criticise those who voluntarily give up their time to do so on my behalf. I've stayed out of the Stanley affair and waited for some official position from the committee. I'm probably more patient than many others on this board have been. I realsise that the committee only meets once a month and maybe haven't had much oppportunity to come to a position - but with the amount of flak flying around I expected them to have come up with something by now....

[Cockatrice]

Re the vote was just trying to highlight that despite what one thinks not everyone has made the effort.

I highlighted this before when some of the first events were poorly attended in an effort to see why so many didn't want to come and get involved in anything. What I and others came up with was that there is a total lack of communication between membership and committee.

One reason at the start was the fact that the URSC did not have a list of its own membership as that was held by UR but eventually it was forthcoming. That at least enabled the club to try and make contact with its membership.

More recently one member highlighted the idea of a News Letter but this was still awaiting approval when I left. That would at least give the club the opportunity to reach out and inform all its membership what was on offer.

To change tact slightlyI fail to understand why the event on Boxing Day at Ravenhill with 12,500 in attendence would have failed. It was cancelled and I would and have asked when so as I could at least satisfy myself that some effort was made to hold it.

I go back to my original question as to why 900-1,000 people join something and don't become involved and communication must be the single biggest reason.

I suspect that are at least a number of people that use the membership in an effort to obtain international tickets.

Paul -I understand the concerns that you and many others had with the MOU I had them as well but it doesn'tlook as if anyone can be held to them IMHO and presumably they will be discussed at the next AGM as if correct members didn't get the chance at the last one when it should have been maybe raised then.

[Gary]

Basically correct CT. you know the problems we had trying to make people aware of the events. I remember one opportunity being missed when UR sent an advert out to all our members about a discount on jerseys or something. We could have put a flyer in with this if we'd known.
Re the MOU, did you not vote for it on the Committee? I know I did mainly because it was really carried forward from the previous Committee. Wish I hadn't now - but it wouldn't have made any difference as everyone else voted for it. But totally agree it should have been ready in time for the last agm.

[B.Y.O]

I AGREE WITH A LITTLE OF EVERYTHING THAT HAS BEEN POSTED. BUT IN DEFENCE OF THE POLL IT WAS AN ATTEMPT AT A SERIOUS ONE!
I JUST HOPE THAT THE MAJORITY OF THE URSC CAN BE BOTHERED TO GO TO THE NEXT AGM IF IT IS GOING TO BE THE ONLY VEHICLE FOR CHANGE!
REGARDS b.y.o

[BR]

I think we all know that the introduction of URSC membership as an option on the season ticket has had two effects:

1. It increased membership substantially (I have no figures, but certainly it was what made me and others join).

2. The knock-on effect of 1) is that the majority of members have no real active interest in the club.


'Appathy' is in fact the biggest factor in poor attendance at club events, but 'communication' is the biggest factor that can be addressed. However in order to address this, we need the cooperation of UR and from what I hear they are simply not interested in helping. Their position over stadium announcements for example is laughable.

For the record I did not join URSC in an attempt to secure international tickets, it was in an effort to contibute to (albeit only financially) and partake in an organisation which would facilitate supporters in their common goal of enjoying Ulster rugby at Ravenhill and elsewhere. It certainly was not about slagging, backstabbing and moaning about those members good enough to get up off their aress and run the bloody thing. Neither was it in some attempt to join forces to fight the resident evil of Mike Ried.

For those who have tried (and continue to try) to run the URSC - well done, you have my thanks for the little that is worth.