Positives & Negatives: Ire V Italy

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againstthehead
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Positives & Negatives: Ire V Italy

Post by againstthehead » Sat Feb 06, 2010 7:59 pm

Positives
- a win
- decent scrum and excellent lineout
- solid performances from most players. Thought TOL and BOD played well with ROG pretty solid.
- i didn't waste 80 yo yos going down to watch that crud
- ulster lads did pretty well with limited opportunities.

Negatives
- couldn't build on the good first half performance
- kick kick kick kick. Killing the game.
- italy were total pish. you have to ask is there much point of them being in the championship. Hopefully they'll be a bit more effective at home with a dodgy ball!
- ref was pretty poor. Whistled italy out of the game in the first half.

Overally, a bit of a damp squib. That said, ireland appear to play just good enough to beat the opposition. We have an amazing ability to step up a few gears when really required. A nice warm up game before next week but nothing more really.
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Re: Positives & Negatives: Ire V Italy

Post by Rooster » Sat Feb 06, 2010 8:56 pm

againstthehead wrote: Negatives

- kick kick kick kick. Killing the game.
Is it just me or does anyone else think Kearney's kicking game today was terrible, Italian lineout was AWOL yet he never tried long touch kicks, or if he did they were nowhere near going out, also his kick and chase was useless as he was kicking far to far forward, yes he is good at positioning in defence but his attacking game seems to have vanished, perhaps a while on the pine might bring him back to earth.
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Re: Positives & Negatives: Ire V Italy

Post by againstthehead » Sat Feb 06, 2010 9:06 pm

I couldn't believe our backline didn't try and mix things up in the 2nd 40 and run from deep. I like playing the percentages but that was another level!! We seem to get bogged down by poor opposition. I wouldn't be surprised if we play a stormer next week!
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Re: Positives & Negatives: Ire V Italy

Post by colinh » Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:08 pm

Rooster wrote:
againstthehead wrote: Negatives

- kick kick kick kick. Killing the game.
Is it just me or does anyone else think Kearney's kicking game today was terrible, Italian lineout was AWOL yet he never tried long touch kicks, or if he did they were nowhere near going out, also his kick and chase was useless as he was kicking far to far forward, yes he is good at positioning in defence but his attacking game seems to have vanished, perhaps a while on the pine might bring him back to earth.
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Re: Positives & Negatives: Ire V Italy

Post by DHK » Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:10 pm

Over on MF.com a whole lot of them are having a go at Trimble, it was Kearney who was pi$h.

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Re: Positives & Negatives: Ire V Italy

Post by Royster » Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:13 pm

I couldn't believe that Ireland didn't kick on after half time but they ended up playing a tactical game which had no rhyme or reason to it. I now believe that DK(who is no fool) just wanted to win without giving France too much information for next week. We can now see the reason for Paddy playing outhalf in the A game a week ago when everyone thought it was pointless. Don't loose the faith,DK will have it sorted.

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Re: Positives & Negatives: Ire V Italy

Post by Shan » Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:46 pm

Now as most know I am one of Kearney's biggest fans but he was quite simply very poor today.His kicking game in particular was as bad as I've seen and on the rare occasion he attempted to run with ball he was stopped pretty quickly.He did have a couple of runs where he beat a couple of defenders and had other positive involvement but on the whole it was a bad performance, in my opinion.To be honest he has had a knack of throwing on a poor performance every year and hopefully that is his only one for this 6N campaign.

Overall it was a disappointing performance and a dismal game.Too much aimless kicking and too much delaying by Italy at ruck times.We need to see an introduction of penalties for consistent missing of touch with maybe yellow cards for repeat offenders.Chip or grubber kicks would have to be excluded of course.Also time penalties should be introduced.Once a ball is presented at a ruck you should have 10 seconds to use it or else a free kick is given.

It's a bit of a waste of time analysing performances today as we never really got going at all.

However I would like to say that the reports of the demise of our scrum now seem premature.Of course now people are saying we have bigger challenges ahead despite the same folk assuring us Italy have one of the best scrums in the world.Ahhhhhhhhhhhh our front row just can't win with some people. >TM >TM

TOL showed that Declan yet again called it right with a very good performance and ROG had a great goalkicking day and his pass to Trimble was pure class.

We need Ferris back as a matter of urgency.I'm not saying McLaughlin did anything particularly wrong but we need Ferris' presence, power,skill and speed.
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Re: Positives & Negatives: Ire V Italy

Post by BR » Sat Feb 06, 2010 10:55 pm

againstthehead wrote:I couldn't believe our backline didn't try and mix things up in the 2nd 40 and run from deep.
We had a backline in the 2nd 40???? :shock:
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Re: Positives & Negatives: Ire V Italy

Post by Shan » Sat Feb 06, 2010 11:01 pm

DHK wrote:Over on MF.com a whole lot of them are having a go at Trimble, it was Kearney who was pi$h.
None of the backs were particularly brilliant today but Kearney was the worst I thought.Then again he was also the one in the spotlight as he is the main clearance kicker.Not making an excuse as my other post states my opinion.

Trimble did well I thought and looked dangerous with ball in hand.In fact he was the only one of the back three that offered an attacking threat.Bowe wasn't in the game at all and when he was he made errors.

You know it's not good when you are praising BOD for his kicking rather than his line breaking or other defence opening manoeuvers.
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Re: Positives & Negatives: Ire V Italy

Post by againstthehead » Sat Feb 06, 2010 11:27 pm

Shan wrote:Now as most know I am one of Kearney's biggest fans but he was quite simply very poor today.His kicking game in particular was as bad as I've seen and on the rare occasion he attempted to run with ball he was stopped pretty quickly.He did have a couple of runs where he beat a couple of defenders and had other positive involvement but on the whole it was a bad performance, in my opinion.To be honest he has had a knack of throwing on a poor performance every year and hopefully that is his only one for this 6N campaign.

Overall it was a disappointing performance and a dismal game.Too much aimless kicking and too much delaying by Italy at ruck times.We need to see an introduction of penalties for consistent missing of touch with maybe yellow cards for repeat offenders.Chip or grubber kicks would have to be excluded of course.Also time penalties should be introduced.Once a ball is presented at a ruck you should have 10 seconds to use it or else a free kick is given.

It's a bit of a waste of time analysing performances today as we never really got going at all.

However I would like to say that the reports of the demise of our scrum now seem premature.Of course now people are saying we have bigger challenges ahead despite the same folk assuring us Italy have one of the best scrums in the world.Ahhhhhhhhhhhh our front row just can't win with some people. >TM >TM

TOL showed that Declan yet again called it right with a very good performance and ROG had a great goalkicking day and his pass to Trimble was pure class.

We need Ferris back as a matter of urgency.I'm not saying McLaughlin did anything particularly wrong but we need Ferris' presence, power,skill and speed.

agree with all those points. Something needs to be done to reduce aimless kicking and I reckon the 9 should be warned to pass after 5 secs and pinged on 10 secs. Thought the ref was a bit harsh against italy at scrum time so it will be interesting to see how we fair against the french next week.
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Re: Positives & Negatives: Ire V Italy

Post by Shan » Sat Feb 06, 2010 11:33 pm

againstthehead wrote:
Thought the ref was a bit harsh against italy at scrum time so it will be interesting to see how we fair against the french next week.
That is a very fair point and maybe that is why our scrum performed as well as it did.We'll have to see how they get on over the course of the championships to make a proper assessment.

If they do hold their own against France it would be nice if they got some credit(not a go at you ATH)
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Re: Positives & Negatives: Ire V Italy

Post by bogboy » Sun Feb 07, 2010 1:45 am

You can only play the game as defined by the rules and the opposition ie if the ball is fielded outside the 22,or kicked outside the 22 the return kick must land in field -- most teams thus defend a return kick with a deep three - who if they don' run the ball back are again kicking in field to a deep three .

a short kick return is high risk -- thus most teams at International level kick long which means receivers are seldom under pressure -- but should the receiver attempt a run return then after 10 paces every player on the opposite side is on side thus he he is usually running into an across field defence on the 10 metre line.

when you play a team like Italy who kick most of their possession the safe option is to return the kick the Welsh came up against the same problem playing England neither of those teams were willing to pass the ball until they got inside their opponents 22

the only thing to do to stop kick bing bong is allow any kick from inside the 22 to go directly to touch even it the ball has been passed back into the 22.

For kick bing bong games blame the laws and the coaches who opt for a low risk game not the players.

Regarding Kearneys game -- Kearney is a long kicker one of the longest as a runner he is now a known quantity and thus marked as such -- I think to -day he was playing well until the charge down -- after that he started to kick the ball sooner
which gave the Italians more space when receiving and this was reflected in the overall Irish second half performance -- we couldn't put pressure on the Italian backline.
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Re: Positives & Negatives: Ire V Italy

Post by againstthehead » Sun Feb 07, 2010 10:08 am

There's no question that the kicking game is how to win matches in modern rugby. Last year, we kicked everything in our own half (apart from that try we conceded against france...), played the percentages and won the tournament. I expect us to play a similar game plan this year. Ultimitaly winning is what counts and you're right - the current rules rewards such a gameplan. That said, at home to an pathetic italian side it would have been nice if the lads had taken the shackles off in the second half. The match was effectively won, the kicking game wasn't working so let's have a go. On the other hand, this is the style of rugby we will play in the remaining 4 games so it's probably good to get the players well drilled in it's execution.

Serious consideration must be taken to reduce the amount of kicking. I think Brian Moore suggested that a mark in your own 22 should become a penalty. May not be enough but it would be a start. In addition, we need a rule change to make the rucks and mauls more of a contest so more players are tied into this area - currently, defences commit 1-2 players to the breakdown - alternatively reduce the number of players in each side?
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Re: Positives & Negatives: Ire V Italy

Post by Rooster » Sun Feb 07, 2010 10:19 am

With the Italian lineout stuck somewhere between Rome and Milan yesterday the aerial ping pong should have been changed to kicking straight for field position though instead of the vain hope a fullback would knock on in the catch. BOD put in a couple of nice kicks to touch and Kearney should have been doing the same, that would have cut down the aerial stuff and given Ireland more possession in Italian half.
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Re: Positives & Negatives: Ire V Italy

Post by RedKC » Sun Feb 07, 2010 1:24 pm

I have no issue with kicking, I hate poor kicking. Kearney kicked right down the throat of defenders, it was appalling. BOD kicked quite well.

ROG failed to get the backline going really but his goal kicking was excellent, thought paddy had an excellent cameo at 10 for 20 mins (one poor kick aside) we looked more threatening then than the early part of the 2nd half. While he will never be a starting out half its good to have him there as an option if we need to change the game at the end.

TOL was terrible 2nd half, too slow and got caught in posession, took his try well first half and was generally alright with some nice kicks but alot of room for improvement.

Overall though I thought it was a good starting point from which to build for the tournament, everyone got a run, game never in danger and a few players to come back in for France.

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