Bad News Day for the DUPers.

[Rooster]

Bell has released all his documentation and that is obviously quite telling. Of course a public enquiry will order the discovery of every document. I'd imagine Arlene's quest will be to avoid a public enquiry at all costs. The real meat in this sandwich will be when we hear the answer to the cui bono question and we may get that if there is enough in Bell's documents to force the issue. Of course what would be the cost of a judge led PI?

I reckon set them all on top of a pile of burning wood pellets and it wouldn't take them long to tell the truth to get out of the heat

[Snipe Watson]

Bell has released all his documentation and that is obviously quite telling. Of course a public enquiry will order the discovery of every document. I'd imagine Arlene's quest will be to avoid a public enquiry at all costs. The real meat in this sandwich will be when we hear the answer to the cui bono question and we may get that if there is enough in Bell's documents to force the issue. Of course what would be the cost of a judge led PI?

I reckon set them all on top of a pile of burning wood pellets and it wouldn't take them long to tell the truth to get out of the heat

They're all too slippery to stack or burn.

[rumncoke]

That people incurred capital expenditure could of course refer to the manufacture of wood pellets

Question
How many manufactures of wood pellets exist in Northern Ireland ?

When was the plant for the manufacture purchased and what is annual capacity of manufacture of Pellets in Northern Ireland ?

How many boilers are required to enable that plant to break even ?

We're any guarantees given to the manufacturer before the purchaser that plant started production ?

Remember that the more is burnt the better the profit for the supplier of Pellets ?

The dirt may not just be in the user of the pellets but in
the supply chain of pellets ?




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[Jackie Brown]

Here's a big surprise...

http://fermanaghherald.com/2014/10/comm ... -the-year/

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[Rooster]

That people incurred capital expenditure could of course refer to the manufacture of wood pellets

Question
How many manufactures of wood pellets exist in Northern Ireland ?

When was the plant for the manufacture purchased and what is annual capacity of manufacture of Pellets in Northern Ireland ?

How many boilers are required to enable that plant to break even ?

We're any guarantees given to the manufacturer before the purchaser that plant started production ?

Remember that the more is burnt the better the profit for the supplier of Pellets ?

The dirt may not just be in the user of the pellets but in
the supply chain of pellets ?




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I think the capital expenditures referred to was people paying for the actual boilers or at least pretty large deposits on them as most of not all those big ones are imported. Also if they were for legitimate uses like heating large chicken houses which are normally heated with gas there is additional expenditure in the heat distribution through pipework and heat exchange units, fans and radiators in layman terms, it is a full new system and not just a boiler replacement heating existing radiators or for those on the fiddle just running heat out randomly.
Balcas would be main manufacturer of the pellets and they have been at it for years as a by-product of their there mills, there is another firm not long at it but they are also a manufacturer of timber products, most of the rest is imported.
There may be some small producers just producing and burning as it was hinted but I don't know if that actually happens, the woodchip guys though always have used some of their own chips to dry the raw willow so that may be what was referred to as those doing a complete cycle of drying heating and burning but they would be drying far more than they burn in that.

[pwrmoore]

Am I the only one to be concerned that (if Bell's account is correct) the elected ministers are actually accountable to the unelected DUP special advisors and not the other way around. And let's face it if it's like that in the DUP the other parties with ministers probably have similar arrangements

[big mervyn]

Am I the only one to be concerned that (if Bell's account is correct) the elected ministers are actually accountable to the unelected DUP special advisors and not the other way around. And let's face it if it's like that in the DUP the other parties with ministers probably have similar arrangements

Bell is correct in that respect Paul, and if anything, Sinn Fein are worse. Most of their Ministers can't take a dump without the prior say so of their SPADS (and some very unsavoury characters amongst them too).

[pwrmoore]

Am I the only one to be concerned that (if Bell's account is correct) the elected ministers are actually accountable to the unelected DUP special advisors and not the other way around. And let's face it if it's like that in the DUP the other parties with ministers probably have similar arrangements

Bell is correct in that respect Paul, and if anything, Sinn Fein are worse. Most of their Ministers can't take a dump without the prior say so of their SPADS (and some very unsavoury characters amongst them too).

Democracy eh?

[Rooster]

Am I the only one to be concerned that (if Bell's account is correct) the elected ministers are actually accountable to the unelected DUP special advisors and not the other way around. And let's face it if it's like that in the DUP the other parties with ministers probably have similar arrangements

From what I always gathered a special advisor was brought in by a MLA to advise if what the civil servants was saying was correct or in their opinion should something be looked upon in more detail, I know for a fact that when Bríd Rodgers was agriculture minister she had a special advisor who checked things out for her and worked between herself, civil servants and the likes of farmers union and other trade bodies, she was a pretty smart cookie though as she had another unofficial layer in her system in that she then would have phoned a few trusted farmers etc and said "what do you think of this" she then went back with any doubts or queries, I always thought it was pretty good due diligence by her to do that as sometimes people get stuck in a little one upmanship programme and don't see thigs in the way others do.
Fact on DUP is they also have a little chain of outside advisors but they don't necessarily listen to their expert views if they don't suit the party policy.

What you say though Paul seems to be what happens now in most cases.

[ColinM]

At the time the scheme was incepted the minister, secretary and advisors should have bene able to demonstrate how much it could cost and what were the protections which ensured the spending was limited. That is an area that is being too easily brushed aside in the whole debate.

Once these trains are steaming they are hard to stop as Bell found there are too many people with vested interests willing to slow down the process.

The whole thing is rotten from top to bottom. Many lay people had never heard of a SpAd before 10.45 last night and within 15 minutes it became apparent that they themselves are the cartel pulling the strings of the (elected) puppets in the chamber.

[mikerob]

Spads have been around in Westminster for years, as covered in The Thick of It (which like Yes Minster, is more like a documentary than a comedy)

[pwrmoore]

Spads have been around in Westminster for years, as covered in The Thick of It (which like Yes Minster, is more like a documentary than a comedy)

I 've known they existed for a long time but I naively thought they really were advisors not the real government.

[thecrouch]

SPADs in stormont have been in the news before I think. Can't remember specifically, but I definitely remember another SPAD-related commotion in the past.

Could have been when it was revealed how many wheelbarrows are required to cart their salaries home.

[Gerald the Mole]

Can't help thinking back to the DUP conference and them dancing to "Will Greggs on Fire" bar steward were taking the piśś

[Rooster]

SPADs in stormont have been in the news before I think. Can't remember specifically, but I definitely remember another SPAD-related commotion in the past.

Could have been when it was revealed how many wheelbarrows are required to cart their salaries home.

Might be Emma Pengelly supposedly taking a pay cut from SPAD wages down to MLA'S