Leinster v Munster..

[Cormac]

...on the 2nd of October has been confirmed as taking place at Lansdowne Road. Pre-sale of tickets to Leinster STH is from Wed 18th August to midnight on the 22nd. Tickets will go on general release on Monday 23rd.

[aarons]

it sticks in my throat a bit that leinster have a great asset on their doorstep - paid for by all of us - that they can use to boost coffers in a way the rest of us can't. hope there is some wealth redistribution happening as a result of this.

[Cormac]

it sticks in my throat a bit that leinster have a great asset on their doorstep - paid for by all of us - that they can use to boost coffers in a way the rest of us can't. hope there is some wealth redistribution happening as a result of this.

I'm pretty sure that Leinster are being charged for its use by the IRFU. I would also point out that given the way the stadium was paid for, if the IRFU's part of its cost was distributed evenly around the provinces, the cost to UR would be less than 7%* of the total.

* Original cost was to be split
RoI Govt. 50%
IRFU 25%
FAI 25%

From memory that changed slightly as IRFU/FAI paid for some extras that were added on after the split of costs was agreed.

[aarons]

even if leinster are paying standard commercial rates for the stadium, they're still making a profit out of stadium that the other provinces can't hope to. there's not much you can do about the advantages of location, i guess.

even if IRFU was paying 25% of the costs, that doesn't mean the effective cost to UR was a quarter of that. we all paid for the stadium through ticket prices, club membership, merchandise purchases etc etc etc. (though i take the point that RoI residents paid more than NI residents, through taxation).

[ColinM]

Is this a ML game that Leinster season ticket holders are being asked to pay for in addition to their season tickets?

[Cormac]

Is this a ML game that Leinster season ticket holders are being asked to pay for in addition to their season tickets?

No, this is part of the standard season ticket. For example I've a terrace ticket for the RDS and the terrace dwellers are being located in the North Stand for the two LR games. The pre-sale is if Leinster STH wish to purchase extra tickets for family or friends. This is pretty standard for all Leinster home matches.

even if leinster are paying standard commercial rates for the stadium, they're still making a profit out of stadium that the other provinces can't hope to. there's not much you can do about the advantages of location, i guess.

even if IRFU was paying 25% of the costs, that doesn't mean the effective cost to UR was a quarter of that. we all paid for the stadium through ticket prices, club membership, merchandise purchases etc etc etc. (though i take the point that RoI residents paid more than NI residents, through taxation).

The vast majority of the cost of the stadium is covered by the sale of ten-year tickets in the premium section and the sale of corporate boxes, so the cost to the individual provinces should actually be pretty negligible. I'm pretty sure that the IRFU announced recently that a large portion of the debt incurred to build the stadium has already been paid off.

The other provinces could, of course, apply to use the stadium for big matches. I'm sure any home HEC quarters or semis would be played there (perhaps Munster could afford to play home QF in Limerick). Obviously Leinster are fortunate to have such a well-appointed stadium less than a mile from their current location, but that's hardly something new, they've been playing matches there since the 1870's.

[aarons]

I wasn't implying that ur paid a share of the stadium - that's not the way it works, I know. Nor was I implying it is a new thing. It's irritating but what can you do...

[Raging Raven]

All IRFU ticket holders (ten year tickets) have the right to buy up to a maximum of four tickets to this fixture before they go on general release. Pre-sale will open at 10.00am on Thursday 19th August.
So even Ulster ticket holders can get in before a lot of Mexicans and Turnips.

[Shan]

it sticks in my throat a bit that leinster have a great asset on their doorstep - paid for by all of us - that they can use to boost coffers in a way the rest of us can't. hope there is some wealth redistribution happening as a result of this.

Hi Aaron, I tend to agree with the point you are making but what I would say is that the use of Lansdowne should mean cash flowing into the IRFU coffers too. I'm sure the IRFU like this arrangement of using the stadium rather than having it idle.

What would be nice to see here is Leinster getting a normal full house RDS gate plus maybe 10% or so as an incentive to play the game at Lansdowne Road. The IRFU could take the rest and the costs could then be worked out between them.

The IRFU would have to be confident of a big gate to make it worthwhile for them so they would need to dictate the matches that can and cannot be played.


Of course given the IRFU's long record of favouring Leinster this won't happen.

[Dublin4]

Let's hope Leinster v Ulster gets to be there as well.
Using the new stadium is good for everyone especially as tickets for internationals will now be scarce. Big matches increase the glamour and attention rugby gets which is good for the game and brings kids along. The revenue is handy too and will percolate around the four provinces.

It will be a far cry from the 1,000 or so who attended interpros in my youth.

[Cormac]

Rental fee is payable to the stadium company (managed by IRFU and FAI) rather than just to the IRFU and according to this morning's Irish Times, Leinster are still in negotiations as to what that will be. Article also expands on Leinster's comittment to the RDS with whom they have a 20 year deal, which has a break clause after 10 years. Deal started in 2007. They also have a comittment to play 13 games a year there, so the arrival of the two Italian teams into the ML has been a bonus. The 13 games could be covered by 12 Leinster games and the schools' final, which gives them the leeway to stage 2 regular games a season at the new stadium, excluding any knockout games.

They're also hoping to redevelop the Anglesea Stand (the old one facing the cameras) and improve the capacity to 23-24k (from 18.5k).

[Dublin4]

~Today's Irish Times is very informative:

THE INTRODUCTION of two Italian teams, the Benetton Treviso and Aironi franchises, to this season’s Magners League tournament has allowed Leinster two potential lucrative pay days at the Aviva Stadium. The Irish province will play their home fixture against Munster in the Magners League on Saturday, October 2nd (7.30pm) and also a Heineken Cup Pool clash with Clermont Auvergne on Saturday, December 18th (5.45pm) at the newly-refurbished stadium.

Leinster has a long-standing agreement to play a certain number of fixtures per season at the RDS but with the incorporation of the Italian sides into the Magners League it has given the province the scope to shift two matches to the Aviva Stadium.

Mick Dawson, Leinster’s chief executive, explained: “We have a 20-year arrangement with the RDS with a break clause after 10 years to play 13 matches a season there so, with the two extra Magners League games and the schools’ cup (final) match, that takes us up to our quota.

“They understand what we are trying to do. In the long-term we would be hoping to knock down the Anglesea Stand and improve that stadium (the RDS) and get it up to about 23-24,000 which is probably about right. So, events here (in the Aviva) would be novelty events and we would hope that a lot of people who never get to an international here would take the opportunity to come and watch Leinster play.

“At the moment it wouldn’t be our intention to play any more games in the Aviva. We think two is about right and the reason for that is that we want to fill it out on both occasions.

“It is very important from a player’s perspective that we get it full and that it has the right atmosphere in the place. The RDS is still our home and we are committed to them long-term.”

Sport isn’t impervious to the current economic climate but Dawson is confident the decision to switch those two matches to the Aviva Stadium will be well supported by the public.

“We are optimistic that, with the market research we have done, if we can fill it for the Munster match, we will have had a good atmosphere.

“Hopefully the team will be going well and that is important, but we have a plan. Clermont obviously won’t bring too many people with them whereas Munster will probably take their quota of about 8,000-9,000 tickets. We are hopeful we will fill it.”

Leinster’s 13,000 season-ticket holders will be accommodated for the double-header but have also been contacted and given first option to purchase additional tickets for the Munster game. Any remaining tickets for the derby will go on public sale next Monday (10am) from www.leinsterrugby.ie and Ticketmaster outlets nationwide. Prices start from €30 while family concessions are also available.

Unlike with the previous incarnation, Lansdowne Road, Leinster will have to pay to rent the Aviva Stadium for the two matches. Dawson confirmed: “There is a stadium company who you deal with and the IRFU and FAI are stakeholders in that company. They have a rate they charge and we are like anyone coming along. There is a rate involved.

“There is a rent for the stadium, you pay for all the security; hopefully it will attract 50,000 people and it will be a commercial success for us. You want to be able to go into the market and attract top-quality overseas players so you need a strong balance sheet to do that.”

As yet Leinster do not have a rental figure – but as a constituent of one of the owners they’d probably be good for a discounted rate – with Dawson explaining that “there at still certain things to be worked out at board level but the FAI and IRFU have an arrangement where some of their stakeholders are coming and there is an agreed fee but it hasn’t been sorted yet.

“If we can get the two full houses I think that would say a lot about Leinster rugby. I have said it before, we are in a capital city and we have a huge hinterland in Leinster. This year alone the team have been down to Wexford and Mullingar and out to Clondalkin on training sessions.

“The interest has been phenomenal so the interest has spread. We are trying to drive all those stakeholders to take an opportunity that they might not otherwise get which is to get into the Aviva Stadium.”

[dropkick]

I presume they won't have to pay money to the FAI. Now that would be annoying! lol

Regarding the stadium. The IRFU could have gotten hundreds of millions of Euro from selling the land around Lansdowne road. They could have build a 65,000 - 85,000 seater stadium on the outskirts of Dublin and actually owned it themselves with tens of millions of euro left over to develop rugby and other stadiums throughout the island.

They would then have gotten paid rent from the FAI because the FAI would not have been co-owners. Money from concerts would have gone straight to the IRFU and not half to the FAI etc. The stadium would have been bigger and able to hold more fans and for people from outside Dublin it would probably have been easier to get to.

The benefits of the new stadium is that its in south Dublin where most Leinster fans are from. It also allows Leinster to play games there knowing there'll be a good chance of a full house.

I mentioned before that theres no doubt it suits Leinster rugby (south Dublin fans especially) perfectly and that got priority over the greater good of Irish rugby. Having a stadium in the city center is better than in the outskirts of a city but the financial rewards they could have got for having it on the outskirts would have been great for Irish rugby.

[Cormac]

I believe that within a certain time period, think i've seen 50 years bandied about, the ownership reverts solely to the IRFU.

The IRFU still own the land, but the building is joint-owned and managed by a company with representation from the two.

Building on the outskirts of Dublin would have involved huge costs in improving access to the area and other infrastructural costs that simply weren't an issue with the current location.

[BR]

Building on the outskirts of Dublin would have involved huge costs in improving access to the area and other infrastructural costs that simply weren't an issue with the current location.

But then you're ignoring the extra costs of building at LR. The architectual/logistical/construction challenges of building on a confined inner-city site between a river and a railway line all came at a cost. That money would have gone a long way to provide infrastructure to a 'Ikea' flat-pack stadium on a out-of-town site. Plenty of good roads out of Dublin now.

I'm not saying I agree with RHH, but as with the Maze debate, lack of infrastructure is often used as a lazy excuse.