Ulster NO 10

[bootlaced]

I think it is time to discuss the Ulster no 10 jersey,the subject that probably pumps the blood pressure of more supporters than any other,is it possible to have an objective debate?,lets see.

Contenders,

Current squad players;


Ian Humphreys,

Probably the most experienced in this position at the moment,can be a complete hero or complete zero,has the potential to create great back play and is currently calm and proficent with his goal kicking,may be perceived as not the greatest tackler,but many other 10s would also fall into this category in other teams.

Niall O' Connor,

Perceived as solid,with a great tactical boot,want to play a long kicking game he is probably the 10 for you,strong in defence but probably not the best distributor along the backline,not getting too many chances to see how is kicking is at the moment but would probably be above average,

Stand in or Stand off

Paddy Wallace,

Declan Kidneys experimental no 10,can get the backline going,can kick tactically,and can defend,but "should" always play no 12 his best and probably his preferred position,

Ruan Pienaar,

Big money signing to play no 9,should probably stay there,unless there is a terrible training ground injury involving all of the above three,

On the way up;

Paddy Jackson,

Development player getting Ravens gametime,personally would like to see him getting a full time slot for them and maybe a Magners game to test his mettle this season,

James McKinney

Basically following along the route of the above but maybe just not this season,although he should concentrate on getting a few games fot the Ravens this season as a target.


My own opinion is that we basically have NOC and IH,both have positives and negatives,I believe we can accomodate both this season, but this can only happen if we have a game plan to match each of them,rainy conditions and we want to play 10 man rugby pick NOC,nice sunny day and we want to have an expansive game use IH,but why not use them both in the same match, mix the match up a bit,this would give both players the same amount of experience especially in Europe [injuries can and will happen to players so lets ensure the back ups have relevant experience].

well thats my pennys worth.

[King Ding]

this topic has been done to death on so many occasions and i wasn't going to bother commenting until i read some of your assessment of your favourite player. So here i go
Your assessment of humph is pretty much on the money so no real complaint.

However your assessment of NOC is frankly laughable.

Perceived as solid,with a great tactical boot

Who in the ulster public thinks he has a "great" tactical boot, not many i would guess, he can kick long and high, but he won't pin a team into the corner because he isn't accurate enough and im doesn't have the ability to spot whats on and capitalise. A correct phrase would be, "he can hoof the ball up the pitch and give the opposition back 3 plenty of time and space to run it back at us"

strong in defence

What matchs thats hes played are you basing this on? Hes no better than humphs in this part of the game imo and for having a rep as being a good tackler falls of a serious amount of them

probably not the best distributor along the backline

Well your right here so well done for recognising some weakness in your wee Niall

[WhiteKnightoftheWeld]

Ulster NO 10 - are you suggesting that we play with no one at outhalf?
hmmm - interesting...

the french typically go for a couple of 9/10 players at half-back.
the kiwis usually (until nonu made the shirt his) interchange between 10/12 at 5/8

some sort of merger between these 2 schools of thought?

or go for something completely off the wall - use of a non-recognised outhalf - eg sticking ferris in there? certainly would secure that particular channel, and just imagine the destruction if he was given quick ball by Pienaar with a good 5 yards ahead of him.

could you expand on what you mean please?

[jackthelad]

"Perceived as solid,with a great tactical boot,want to play a long kicking game he is probably the 10 for you,strong in defence but probably not the best distributor along the backline,not getting too many chances to see how is kicking is at the moment but would probably be above average,"

I've no idea who you mean when you say "percieved". Who has this perception? The evidence is pretty conclusive. He hasn't great tactical boot at all. He can kick the ball a long way. Unfortunately he doesn't have any control as to it's ultimate destination. It's just as likely to land behind him as anyhere else. Thr ball does travel a long way but usually after it has crossed straight over the touch line or over the dead ball line for a scrum back.
His tackling is just as bad as iHumphs except that NOC is so slow he usually doesn't even get there to make the missed tackle. I've seen him make the odd decent pass but just like iHumph last Saturday, often to an opponent for an intercept try. I have no idea either how you come up with the idea that his kicking would be average. It never has been in 4 years.

[WhiteKnightoftheWeld]

would personally like to see paddy jackson brought along as quickly as possible.
get him thrown in early and with his potential, we've got ourselves a biggar or sexton within a few years.

i'd also like to see andy the greek given a shot at it - anytime he's played he's demonstrated his passing ability, hard running when required, and has shown on occasion to be adept when kicking from hand. he's wasted at hooker for me - and certainly with the pecking order as it is, behind brady and rory, he should maybe consider a positional switch.

[Surrey Red Hand]

would personally like to see paddy jackson brought along as quickly as possible.
get him thrown in early and with his potential, we've got ourselves a biggar or sexton within a few years.

i'd also like to see andy the greek given a shot at it - anytime he's played he's demonstrated his passing ability, hard running when required, and has shown on occasion to be adept when kicking from hand. he's wasted at hooker for me - and certainly with the pecking order as it is, behind brady and rory, he should maybe consider a positional switch.

Heard he was off to the USA come end of season?

[WhiteKnightoftheWeld]

Heard he was off to the USA come end of season?

are u asking me? if so i don't know.
if it's a statement of fact then the question mark at the end of your sentence is inappropriate.

[Surrey Red Hand]

Heard he was off to the USA come end of season?

are u asking me? if so i don't know.
if it's a statement of fact then the question mark at the end of your sentence is inappropriate.

Wiked .. I HEARD .. but I can't verify the fact .. hence the ? .. you pedantic person

[bootlaced]

this topic has been done to death on so many occasions and i wasn't going to bother commenting until i read some of your assessment of your favourite player. So here i go
Your assessment of humph is pretty much on the money so no real complaint.

However your assessment of NOC is frankly laughable.

Perceived as solid,with a great tactical boot

Who in the ulster public thinks he has a "great" tactical boot, not many i would guess, he can kick long and high, but he won't pin a team into the corner because he isn't accurate enough and im doesn't have the ability to spot whats on and capitalise. A correct phrase would be, "he can hoof the ball up the pitch and give the opposition back 3 plenty of time and space to run it back at us"

strong in defence

What matchs thats hes played are you basing this on? Hes no better than humphs in this part of the game imo and for having a rep as being a good tackler falls of a serious amount of them

probably not the best distributor along the backline

Well your right here so well done for recognising some weakness in your wee Niall

Dearest King Ding,nowhere on this forum will you find me stating my favourite player is NOC,my favourite players tend to be found in the front row.

Earlier on in the season when baby humps was'nt playing as NOC had the jersey I even questioned why and where baby Humps was and why he was'nt playing in relation to squad rotation,and Humps apparent verbal spat with Doak when brought on to play 15, the jersey does not belong to one individual player,it is on loan for him for 80 mins,imho if you have a poor game you lose the right to have the privilege of wearing that jersey,until you re earn the right to wear it again or the other player wearing it loses the right to wear it,quite an easy concept really,and this should always apply across the team,then I think you will find less stupid decisions, and poor tackles.

In your world King Ding what is gonna happen if Humps is injured,what 10 is gonna replace him,and will that 10 have enough experience?

[Bring Humph On!!]

The whole baby humph v NOC will go on forever and ever! I'm not going to throw my tuppence worth into that ring!!

Has anybody watched much of Jackson or McKinney? I haven't had the chance as yet to see much of either but would be interested to hear if anyone thinks they are up to making the step up? What type of players are they? Strengths and weaknesses that sort of thing?

The other name I would like to throw into the ring is Steenson. His name hasn't been bandied about on here yet which has surprised me. Is he a long term answer or is what we have in Baby Humph and Noc as good as if not better?

[bootlaced]

The whole baby humph v NOC will go on forever and ever! I'm not going to throw my tuppence worth into that ring!!

Has anybody watched much of Jackson or McKinney? I haven't had the chance as yet to see much of either but would be interested to hear if anyone thinks they are up to making the step up? What type of players are they? Strengths and weaknesses that sort of thing?

The other name I would like to throw into the ring is Steenson. His name hasn't been bandied about on here yet which has surprised me. Is he a long term answer or is what we have in Baby Humph and Noc as good as if not better?

forgot to add any potential signings,

re Steenson, http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_u ... 270073.stm


Exeter's Gareth Steenson targets Boxing Day return


Exeter Chiefs fly-half Gareth Steenson has targeted a Boxing Day return for the Premiership club.

The Irishman has been out of action since damaging ligaments in his left knee against London Irish in October.

Steenson told BBC Spotlight: "The injury could have been a lot worse if my leg wasn't in the air.

"It's been very frustrating watching the boys from the stands, but my aim is to get back in the team to face Bath on Boxing Day."

Ryan Davis has replaced Steenson at stand-off since his injury, and has proved a success in the position, notably scoring 18 points in the side's famous win at Saracens.

The Chiefs are currently seventh in the Premiership table, having won five of their 10 games to accumulate 22 points.

Steenson said: "We've surprised a lot of people this season and if we get in the top six then Europe's top sides will be visiting Sandy Park next season in the Heineken Cup, but we know there's a long way to go before we can achieve that.

"We have a good squad here and the confidence is high, knowing we can match and beat the best."

[mikerob]

I saw Jackson play in the B&I Cup game against Bedford last weekend. Distribution, kicking from hand and place kicking were all neat enough but restarts weren't good. The Ravens played mainly through the forwards in the first half and hardly touched the ball in the second half so it was difficult to assess his running game or ability to get a backline moving. Biggest comment was that he didn't seem up to the physicality of the opposition yet (Bedford are currently 2nd in the English Championship) so IMO still needs a while in a pro conditioning program as well as further games for the Ravens.

McKinney replaced him midway through the second half and I wasn't impressed with him at all - guilty of couple of missed penalty touch finders and wayward passes into touch.

[SparkyClarky]

I will add just a couple of thoughts to this one.

As it has already been said every fan has a right to an opinion. His / her opinion is his / her perception of how the game is going. Not everyone is going to agree!

Sometimes perceptions / opinions are changed after discussing / reading some other posters material, I sometimes think "Oh I never thought of it in that way before!"

Some people however will never sway from their own opinion no matter what. So thats that!

On the topic in hand. ihumph can be flaky, can be brilliant. His tackling must be worked on, (Bit like Nigel Bradys after Saturday last.)

NOC, just a tad / bit stronger in defence, was at the start of the season putting enough kicks over, long but not great control out of hand, stands to deep and therefore not my choice. Also dropped on the arrival on Ruan. Has he a preferred option for his game to work better???

Wallace & Pinnear, if both or already in a match day squad our present Management simply think, why waste a bench spot for an out and out 10? if push comes to shove, injury etc we will make one of them the go to man! We know what they can do, they have both played 10 on the International stage!

Hence we will not see an occassion where both NOC & iHumph make the same squad.

Paddy Jackson, totally agree that he needs to have a magners game to test him. But see below comments.

We are now at the important stage of the season. The rotation we had at the start seems to have stopped. Risky decisions are not being taken? The shepherds hook only seems to come out for injury. Therefore I don't think Jackson will see anything other than Ravens matches.

Therefore my concern would be that if the coaches are seen not to trust their bench, extended squad and it could have a negative effect on positive mental attitude throughout the squad.

Bootlaced, I hope this makes it more of a disscussion, its only my opinion and I will not be offended if others cannot agree.

Answer :Do a Cardiff Blues and next year but in someone who is already proven themselves at Magners / HEC & International level?

C'Mon ULSTER!!!

[backawaygoonahead]

Steenson told BBC Spotlight: "The injury could have been a lot worse if my leg wasn't in the air.

Crikey Bob Cherry !! Is Steenson mad ? The injury would have been worse had he been playing in a vacumn

What in the name of the Sweet Holy Whore Baggin' Mother of Feck is he rabbiting on about? Do you really think you should be encouraging this sort of nonsense Boot?

Balderdash




Think this post is mad? The whole feckin' thread is a waste of space. DELETE

[Rule13b]

Humph (baby) is always good for a bit of excitement some good some bad,but watching NOC is boring.
I dont think that either of them is the best solution but I feel that we have to play the hand we have been dealt and go with Humph or perhaps Wallace if he is injured although I think we get the best out of Paddy at No 12.