Any word on the Academy?

[Tap+Go]

Regardless of how good they are, more Leinster cast offs is frustrating

I get what you’re saying but if they are better than what we have (which they are) then you take them no problem.

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A broken system, indeed.

It's also a blow to the pride that we can't produce a half decent flow of quality players

With increased investment, we could potentially address these issues, but unfortunately, that seems unlikely. The decline in interest in teaching exacerbates the problem further, and the situation is only expected to deteriorate without significant intervention.


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It’s also doesn’t help that Ulster have poor representation in the 1st division of AIL. Leinster don’t hand out academy contracts to school leavers - you are expected to do at least a year in the sub academy & also playing AIL. Huge advantage players have there is then the number of Leinster clubs in AIL 1A & 1B with top school leavers usually getting lots of exposure to action which all helps come Ireland U20 selection & then academy contracts. With only 3 clubs in AIL 1A/1B it’s hard for young Ulster players to get lots of exposure at that level with lots having to go to 2A or 2B. Twice as many Munster clubs as Ulster at 1st division level also.

1A: 5 Leinster, 3 Munster, 2 Ulster
1B: 5 Leinster, 3 Munster, 1 Ulster, 1 Connacht

[Bayern]

Ulster U19 Development lost 26-12 to Connacht u19

1. Zak Molyneaux (RBAI)
2. James Clark (RBAI)
3. Rio McDonagh (Wallace HS)
4. Scott Gray (CCB)
5. Ryan Halpin (Down HS)
6. Jake Scott (Sullivan Upper)
7. Thomas Dougan (Royal School Armagh)
8. Callum McKinney (Campbell College)
9. Callum Soper (RBAI)
10. Henry Ralston (Campbell College)
11. Joel Barron (Friends' School Lisburn)
12. Rob Henderson (Friends' School Lisburn)
13. Ethan Spratt (Regent House)
14. Josh Geddis (Wallace HS)
15. Evan McGonigle (Regent House)
16. Jed Dornan (Campbell College)
17. Toby Newman (Enniskillen RGS)
18. Tom Pitts (Rainey Endowed)
19. Loughlin Sweeney (RBAI)
20. Ethan Pavlovic (Belfast Royal Academy)
21. Willie John Bradley (Coleraine RFC)
22. Eoin Ratchford (Enniskillen RFC)
23. Tom Wylie (Ballymena Academy)
24. Callum Irvine (Ballymena Academy)

[Jetstream]

Ulster U19 Development lost 26-12 to Connacht u19

1. Zak Molyneaux (RBAI)
2. James Clark (RBAI)
3. Rio McDonagh (Wallace HS)
4. Scott Gray (CCB)
5. Ryan Halpin (Down HS)
6. Jake Scott (Sullivan Upper)
7. Thomas Dougan (Royal School Armagh)
8. Callum McKinney (Campbell College)
9. Callum Soper (RBAI)
10. Henry Ralston (Campbell College)
11. Joel Barron (Friends' School Lisburn)
12. Rob Henderson (Friends' School Lisburn)
13. Ethan Spratt (Regent House)
14. Josh Geddis (Wallace HS)
15. Evan McGonigle (Regent House)
16. Jed Dornan (Campbell College)
17. Toby Newman (Enniskillen RGS)
18. Tom Pitts (Rainey Endowed)
19. Loughlin Sweeney (RBAI)
20. Ethan Pavlovic (Belfast Royal Academy)
21. Willie John Bradley (Coleraine RFC)
22. Eoin Ratchford (Enniskillen RFC)
23. Tom Wylie (Ballymena Academy)
24. Callum Irvine (Ballymena Academy)

9 teams play senior schools rugby in Connacht and we are getting stuffed by them.

[Horse15]

Shocking - this sort of game is a waste of time and resource by Ulster. None of those kids will be anywhere near pro rugby. That year group one of the weakest yet.

[ljsulster]

Ulster U19 Development lost 26-12 to Connacht u19

1. Zak Molyneaux (RBAI)
2. James Clark (RBAI)
3. Rio McDonagh (Wallace HS)
4. Scott Gray (CCB)
5. Ryan Halpin (Down HS)
6. Jake Scott (Sullivan Upper)
7. Thomas Dougan (Royal School Armagh)
8. Callum McKinney (Campbell College)
9. Callum Soper (RBAI)
10. Henry Ralston (Campbell College)
11. Joel Barron (Friends' School Lisburn)
12. Rob Henderson (Friends' School Lisburn)
13. Ethan Spratt (Regent House)
14. Josh Geddis (Wallace HS)
15. Evan McGonigle (Regent House)
16. Jed Dornan (Campbell College)
17. Toby Newman (Enniskillen RGS)
18. Tom Pitts (Rainey Endowed)
19. Loughlin Sweeney (RBAI)
20. Ethan Pavlovic (Belfast Royal Academy)
21. Willie John Bradley (Coleraine RFC)
22. Eoin Ratchford (Enniskillen RFC)
23. Tom Wylie (Ballymena Academy)
24. Callum Irvine (Ballymena Academy)

9 teams play senior schools rugby in Connacht and we are getting stuffed by them.

Bit of a mish mash of a team missing the following who I would class as probable starters/23:
Blake McLean RBAI
Conor Magee Banbridge
Josh Gibson RBAI
Matthew Heasley Dromore
Oliver Hughes Dalriada
Jacob Lennox Coleraine
Tyrese Abolarin MCB
Fraser Cunningham RBAI
Michael McLean Ballymena
Frank Davis BRA

Any age grade team coached by Ricky Andrew is destined for failure- pure neglect from UR imo, he’s terrible

[rumncoke]

Term break selections are basically a lottery of not necessarily the best but the available . Hence the numbers selected and the fact the games are not so much competitive but indicative of potential or in many cases the lack of it .

When you look at the numbers who are actually make the Academy you understand the nature of the games . Its not team performance that counts but individual performance and thus the team performance suffers.

[rumncoke]

Term break selections are basically a lottery of not necessarily the best but the available . Hence the numbers selected and the fact the games are not so much competitive but indicative of potential or in many cases the lack of it .

When you look at the numbers who are actually make the Academy you understand the nature of the games . Its not team performance that counts but individual performance and thus the team performance suffers.

[Big-al]

Shocking - this sort of game is a waste of time and resource by Ulster. None of those kids will be anywhere near pro rugby. That year group one of the weakest yet.

Defiantly. The next two batch u20s from Ulster are probably the weakest in a decade, if not longer.

[Horse15]

Shocking - this sort of game is a waste of time and resource by Ulster. None of those kids will be anywhere near pro rugby. That year group one of the weakest yet.

Defiantly. The next two batch u20s from Ulster are probably the weakest in a decade, if not longer.

I would go as far as to include current crop who won just one of their interpros. Interesting that there was a really good MCB team but many pulled out of the system.

[Tap+Go]

Ulster U19 Development lost 26-12 to Connacht u19

1. Zak Molyneaux (RBAI)
2. James Clark (RBAI)
3. Rio McDonagh (Wallace HS)
4. Scott Gray (CCB)
5. Ryan Halpin (Down HS)
6. Jake Scott (Sullivan Upper)
7. Thomas Dougan (Royal School Armagh)
8. Callum McKinney (Campbell College)
9. Callum Soper (RBAI)
10. Henry Ralston (Campbell College)
11. Joel Barron (Friends' School Lisburn)
12. Rob Henderson (Friends' School Lisburn)
13. Ethan Spratt (Regent House)
14. Josh Geddis (Wallace HS)
15. Evan McGonigle (Regent House)
16. Jed Dornan (Campbell College)
17. Toby Newman (Enniskillen RGS)
18. Tom Pitts (Rainey Endowed)
19. Loughlin Sweeney (RBAI)
20. Ethan Pavlovic (Belfast Royal Academy)
21. Willie John Bradley (Coleraine RFC)
22. Eoin Ratchford (Enniskillen RFC)
23. Tom Wylie (Ballymena Academy)
24. Callum Irvine (Ballymena Academy)

9 teams play senior schools rugby in Connacht and we are getting stuffed by them.

Bit of a mish mash of a team missing the following who I would class as probable starters/23:
Blake McLean RBAI
Conor Magee Banbridge
Josh Gibson RBAI
Matthew Heasley Dromore
Oliver Hughes Dalriada
Jacob Lennox Coleraine
Tyrese Abolarin MCB
Fraser Cunningham RBAI
Michael McLean Ballymena
Frank Davis BRA

Any age grade team coached by Ricky Andrew is destined for failure- pure neglect from UR imo, he’s terrible

Yeah a lot still to come in. A development game pre summer squad finalisation so a number of that team may drop out.

Another year with no stand out no.10 though - becoming a recurring theme unfortunately. Couple of prospects in U18 so be interesting to see how they develop.

Really don’t get why Andrew moved to u19 instead of Jonny Graham - especially as Graham Irish u19 assistant. Certainly were some interesting (?!) selection calls at u19 last year.

[Blow in]

I get what you’re saying but if they are better than what we have (which they are) then you take them no problem.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

A broken system, indeed.

It's also a blow to the pride that we can't produce a half decent flow of quality players

With increased investment, we could potentially address these issues, but unfortunately, that seems unlikely. The decline in interest in teaching exacerbates the problem further, and the situation is only expected to deteriorate without significant intervention.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It’s also doesn’t help that Ulster have poor representation in the 1st division of AIL. Leinster don’t hand out academy contracts to school leavers - you are expected to do at least a year in the sub academy & also playing AIL. Huge advantage players have there is then the number of Leinster clubs in AIL 1A & 1B with top school leavers usually getting lots of exposure to action which all helps come Ireland U20 selection & then academy contracts. With only 3 clubs in AIL 1A/1B it’s hard for young Ulster players to get lots of exposure at that level with lots having to go to 2A or 2B. Twice as many Munster clubs as Ulster at 1st division level also.

1A: 5 Leinster, 3 Munster, 2 Ulster
1B: 5 Leinster, 3 Munster, 1 Ulster, 1 Connacht

Do Clubs benefit from having these players released to them?, Club guys shouldn't miss out for a sproggy academy player, who could weaken the team.
Queens have been woeful this year after their big partnership announcement with UR.
Look a bit lower and the Ulster clubs have decent representation;
2A- 3 teams
2B-3 teams
2C-Potentialy 3 or possibly 2

[Tap+Go]

A broken system, indeed.

It's also a blow to the pride that we can't produce a half decent flow of quality players

With increased investment, we could potentially address these issues, but unfortunately, that seems unlikely. The decline in interest in teaching exacerbates the problem further, and the situation is only expected to deteriorate without significant intervention.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

It’s also doesn’t help that Ulster have poor representation in the 1st division of AIL. Leinster don’t hand out academy contracts to school leavers - you are expected to do at least a year in the sub academy & also playing AIL. Huge advantage players have there is then the number of Leinster clubs in AIL 1A & 1B with top school leavers usually getting lots of exposure to action which all helps come Ireland U20 selection & then academy contracts. With only 3 clubs in AIL 1A/1B it’s hard for young Ulster players to get lots of exposure at that level with lots having to go to 2A or 2B. Twice as many Munster clubs as Ulster at 1st division level also.

1A: 5 Leinster, 3 Munster, 2 Ulster
1B: 5 Leinster, 3 Munster, 1 Ulster, 1 Connacht

Do Clubs benefit from having these players released to them?, Club guys shouldn't miss out for a sproggy academy player, who could weaken the team.
Queens have been woeful this year after their big partnership announcement with UR.
Look a bit lower and the Ulster clubs have decent representation;
2A- 3 teams
2B-3 teams
2C-Potentialy 3 or possibly 2

Coming at it from a player & not club point of view.
If an Ulster underage prospect doesn’t get given Academy straight out of school (i.e. like old sub academy level but now called NTS/PTS) they have significantly less division 1 options than Leinster & also Munster players coming into senior rugby. This contributes to less exposure at the higher levels in AIL which in turn impacts chances of Ireland U20 selection, academy places etc. U20 selectors are going to go for a guy playing at 1A/1B over someone playing 2A/2B everytime.

Just think it’s really hard for anyone 18/19 years old in Ulster to push through - when some might be starting to flourish around that time.

[solidarity]

Shocking - this sort of game is a waste of time and resource by Ulster. None of those kids will be anywhere near pro rugby. That year group one of the weakest yet.

Defiantly. The next two batch u20s from Ulster are probably the weakest in a decade, if not longer.

I would go as far as to include current crop who won just one of their interpros. Interesting that there was a really good MCB team but many pulled out of the system.

And that last comment sums it up. What can we do to ensure that players aren't pushed so hard at school that they think, 'Sod this for a lark. Why would I keep on with this thing from which all the playful joy has been sucked out?

[kingofthehill]

Shocking - this sort of game is a waste of time and resource by Ulster. None of those kids will be anywhere near pro rugby. That year group one of the weakest yet.

Defiantly. The next two batch u20s from Ulster are probably the weakest in a decade, if not longer.

I would go as far as to include current crop who won just one of their interpros. Interesting that there was a really good MCB team but many pulled out of the system.

And that last comment sums it up. What can we do to ensure that players aren't pushed so hard at school that they think, 'Sod this for a lark. Why would I keep on with this thing from which all the playful joy has been sucked out?

This year’s MCB team was weak (in the junior end the current U6th were decent but just didn’t develop).

MCB are now very weak through the whole school bar their current u13s who are ok. This is awful for ulster rugby.

Is it your belief that students at MCB are subjected to excessive pressure/‘pushed so hard’ compared to those attending the Dublin schools? Such a notion is complete nonsense.

The contrasting factor lies in the aspirations of students at schools like Michael’s, Rock, and CWC, who aim to become professional rugby players, a mentality not prevalent in Ulster schools rugby.

In my opinion, this disparity underscores the importance of investing in teachers/coaches and facilities across all age groups within the school system. Ulster lags significantly behind Leinster and Munster.

Teaching has become completely unattractive for young professionals. Then they're asked to engage in extracurricular activities on Saturdays without adequate compensation. Dublin schools will pay 19 year old coaches (who don’t have qualifications) €200 a week for 2 sessions a week and a Saturday morning with a u13 team. Teachers in the North will be getting £20-30 which is taxed. It has reached a point where it's almost absurd, and it's likely to kill school boy rugby in Ulster sooner rather than later.

Despite the establishment of a committee in Ulster aimed at addressing the issue, no substantial changes are expected to occur without significant financial backing. So….. basically a complete waste of time.


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[nonplussed]

Shocking - this sort of game is a waste of time and resource by Ulster. None of those kids will be anywhere near pro rugby. That year group one of the weakest yet.

Defiantly. The next two batch u20s from Ulster are probably the weakest in a decade, if not longer.

I would go as far as to include current crop who won just one of their interpros. Interesting that there was a really good MCB team but many pulled out of the system.

And that last comment sums it up. What can we do to ensure that players aren't pushed so hard at school that they think, 'Sod this for a lark. Why would I keep on with this thing from which all the playful joy has been sucked out?

This year’s MCB team was weak (in the junior end the current U6th were decent but just didn’t develop).

MCB are now very weak through the whole school bar their current u13s who are ok. This is awful for ulster rugby.

Is it your belief that students at MCB are subjected to excessive pressure/‘pushed so hard’ compared to those attending the Dublin schools? Such a notion is complete nonsense.

The contrasting factor lies in the aspirations of students at schools like Michael’s, Rock, and CWC, who aim to become professional rugby players, a mentality not prevalent in Ulster schools rugby.

In my opinion, this disparity underscores the importance of investing in teachers/coaches and facilities across all age groups within the school system. Ulster lags significantly behind Leinster and Munster.

Teaching has become completely unattractive for young professionals. Then they're asked to engage in extracurricular activities on Saturdays without adequate compensation. Dublin schools will pay 19 year old coaches (who don’t have qualifications) €200 a week for 2 sessions a week and a Saturday morning with a u13 team. Teachers in the North will be getting £20-30 which is taxed. It has reached a point where it's almost absurd, and it's likely to kill school boy rugby in Ulster sooner rather than later.

Despite the establishment of a committee in Ulster aimed at addressing the issue, no substantial changes are expected to occur without significant financial backing. So….. basically a complete waste of time.


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These figures are absolutely damning, and as a father who's sons benefit from the efforts, time and skill of coaches in 2 different schools I find this appalling. Both have had excellent coaches this year who have elevated the boys' confidence and skills to a new level and brought about a fair level of success, for which I am very grateful