And today, joining the underground .....

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Snipe Watson
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Re: And today, joining the underground .....

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Dave wrote: Sat Nov 06, 2021 1:35 pm On faith, just one last point so this thread can go back to pointing out celebrities who have snuffed it. I get what some are saying with faith and the little bit of doubt at times. Faith is a good concept for many. Faith ought not be mistaken, however, for knowledge. Faith is at least recognition that 'I do not know', but I am believing anyway through choice. Therefore, doubt is perfectly understandable. When it is proposed by individuals that they have a relationship with said deity. It is unclear how there would then be room for doubt. As a relationship would require, I'm sure, reciprocal communication. Otherwise, it appears as is often explained by non-theists, believers are perhaps mis-interpreting thoughts, feelings, certain experience etc as confirmation of reciprocation. This applies to all those of religious faith. There is no way of determining any experience as genuinely material, as opposed to simulation. Essentially we are all in the dark with the only certainty being uncertainty.
I deal with doubts and questions every day mate. I'm not an unquestioning believer, i came on a long and interesting journey to get to where I am today and I'm the better for it. I discovered about thirty years ago that I didn't have enough faith to be an atheist*
* nicked that line >EW
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Dave
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Re: And today, joining the underground .....

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Cap'n Grumpy wrote:
Dave wrote: Fri Nov 05, 2021 6:37 pm It isn't a fact. It could be falsified by new information discovered in the future where factors other than natural selection/adaptation are at play. That's true scientific inquiry. It's leaving the door open so that objectivity can lead to new learning.
Even if new factors other than natural selection/adaptation are subsequently seen to be at play, it doesn't change the fact that evolution occurs.

I don't see how that can be falsified. It might change our understanding a little about how evolution occurs in one or more species, but won't change the fact that it does.

Nor does that prevent objectivity leading to new learning.
Evolution (in this context) is not just change or adaptation it is based on natural selection, as per the theory of evolution, Darwin. This is why I was referring to it as theory to make this distinction, but you did I have to say, take exception to it. Other mechanisms such as viral infection and methods of DNA exchange have been observed.

If you are saying that evolution occurs (as in the adverb), it happens, we must make the assumption of a material universe. This is what I'm telling people!! We might be in a simulation. We know nothing.
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Cap'n Grumpy
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Re: And today, joining the underground .....

Post by Cap'n Grumpy »

Dave wrote: Sat Nov 06, 2021 8:13 pm
Cap'n Grumpy wrote:
Dave wrote: Fri Nov 05, 2021 6:37 pm It isn't a fact. It could be falsified by new information discovered in the future where factors other than natural selection/adaptation are at play. That's true scientific inquiry. It's leaving the door open so that objectivity can lead to new learning.
Even if new factors other than natural selection/adaptation are subsequently seen to be at play, it doesn't change the fact that evolution occurs.

I don't see how that can be falsified. It might change our understanding a little about how evolution occurs in one or more species, but won't change the fact that it does.

Nor does that prevent objectivity leading to new learning.
Evolution (in this context) is not just change or adaptation it is based on natural selection, as per the theory of evolution, Darwin. This is why I was referring to it as theory to make this distinction, but you did I have to say, take exception to it. Other mechanisms such as viral infection and methods of DNA exchange have been observed.

If you are saying that evolution occurs (as in the adverb), it happens, we must make the assumption of a material universe. This is what I'm telling people!! We might be in a simulation. We know nothing.
Well, you be in a simulation if you like, and put it in whatever context you want. I'll just go my own sweet way knowing what I know, and you can know nothing if that's what floats yer boat. :thumleft:
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Dave
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Re: And today, joining the underground .....

Post by Dave »


Cap'n Grumpy wrote: Well, you be in a simulation if you like, and put it in whatever context you want. I'll just go my own sweet way knowing what I know, and you can know nothing if that's what floats yer boat. :thumleft:
I agree with your sentiment. Sadly we won't get to choose. Best to go along with our assumptions until further notice.
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solidarity
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Re: And today, joining the underground .....

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Dave wrote: Sun Nov 07, 2021 11:39 am
Cap'n Grumpy wrote: Well, you be in a simulation if you like, and put it in whatever context you want. I'll just go my own sweet way knowing what I know, and you can know nothing if that's what floats yer boat. :thumleft:
I agree with your sentiment. Sadly we won't get to choose. Best to go along with our assumptions until further notice.
Coming from a different place, happy to agree to 'go along with our assumptions until further notice'.
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solidarity
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Re: And today, joining the underground .....

Post by solidarity »

Terence Wilson (Astro) from UB40 has died. Loved their 'Red Red Wine' from my twenties but their version of 'Can't help falling in love with you' was a bit too dark for my taste.

I don't recall UB40 being lauded for being multi-racial. Maybe I missed it. I wonder if today they would be criticised for being mostly white guys 'culturally appropriating' reggae.
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Re: And today, joining the underground .....

Post by big mervyn »

solidarity wrote: Sun Nov 07, 2021 9:37 pm Terence Wilson (Astro) from UB40 has died. Loved their 'Red Red Wine' from my twenties but their version of 'Can't help falling in love with you' was a bit too dark for my taste.

I don't recall UB40 being lauded for being multi-racial. Maybe I missed it. I wonder if today they would be criticised for being mostly white guys 'culturally appropriating' reggae.
Ahh they were definitely about racial harmony Solids though maybe not fraternal harmony! They were just up the road from the whole "two tone" phenomenon although i don't think they were actually part of that record label.

They were a respectful homage to, rather than an appropriation of the original music imho I came to a lot of the originsl recordings through the likes of UB40 and the Specials. Not dissimilar to the British RnB bands of the 60s reviving the Blues in America. Tony Tribes original reggae version of Red Red Wine is fantastic and so is Dandy Livingstones "Rudy, A Message to You" which the Specials covered.
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Re: And today, joining the underground .....

Post by Bart S »

People will always associate UB40 with Red Red Wine but for me you can’t beat the classic lyrics of Rat In The Kitchen.
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solidarity
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Re: And today, joining the underground .....

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Merv, you've opened a new door for me! Just spent a very happy couple of hours drifting through Trojan Records classics: some I'd never heard of, some originals where I knew the covers and even some 'Trojan' covers of songs from other genres. I just let You tube run and came across an extremely poingant clip of Amy Winehouse guesting with The Specials. The two songs were 'This is the end' and Ghost town'; tragically appropriate for Amy.
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Re: And today, joining the underground .....

Post by Bart S »

Worth checking out Amy's live performance of Monkey Man by The Specials.
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Re: And today, joining the underground .....

Post by big mervyn »

solidarity wrote: Mon Nov 08, 2021 11:01 pm Merv, you've opened a new door for me! Just spent a very happy couple of hours drifting through Trojan Records classics: some I'd never heard of, some originals where I knew the covers and even some 'Trojan' covers of songs from other genres. I just let You tube run and came across an extremely poingant clip of Amy Winehouse guesting with The Specials. The two songs were 'This is the end' and Ghost town'; tragically appropriate for Amy.
That's the great thing about music. One thing leads to another. I just keep going further back with the blues discovering the likes of Tommy Johnson ( the original who sold his soul to tje devil NOT Robert) Charlie Patton. Son House and others. Totally into Ottilie Patterson at the minute, Ulster's greatest unsung musical heroine imho. I'm retrospectively in love with her :lol:
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Re: And today, joining the underground .....

Post by Bobbievee »

Ray McLoughlin, Irish captain and Britsh and Irish Lion. Aged 82
star of the amateur era
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Re: And today, joining the underground .....

Post by rumncoke »

Just a closer walk with thee the B side was take my hand precious Lord — which does not seem to be available on I tunes unfortunately

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Re: And today, joining the underground .....

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Tomás O'Leary's aul fella passed away today. Great hurler in his day.
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Cap'n Grumpy
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Re: And today, joining the underground .....

Post by Cap'n Grumpy »

Amiga500 wrote: Wed Dec 01, 2021 10:45 pm Great hurler in his day.
Could he not hold his drink?

:puker: ????
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