Vote early, vote often.

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big mervyn
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Re: Vote early, vote often.

Post by big mervyn »

Big-al wrote: Tue May 24, 2022 1:43 pm I notice Mary Lou McDonald on GMB putting her case forward for a border poll within the next decade. >sniper >bud
I struggle to see why the Unionists are so opposed to one. If the numbers are overwhelmingly in favour of the Union why not have one and put it to bed for a generation?
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Re: Vote early, vote often.

Post by Big-al »

I’m not opposed of one. There has been a consistent 60/40 split on it since the 90’s. Nothing positive will come of it. It will cause further division in society.
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big mervyn
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Re: Vote early, vote often.

Post by big mervyn »

Big-al wrote: Tue May 24, 2022 3:55 pm I’m not opposed of one. There has been a consistent 60/40 split on it since the 90’s. Nothing positive will come of it. It will cause further division in society.
Further division :lol: It's not going away. Imo it should be a mandatory question on every census. Only problem with that is there are to be no more censuses I believe? :lol: You'd thing that plural would be censi wouldn't you?

Votes on the constitutional position should be compulsory albeit with an option to abstain. Should have been with Brexit and should be with this. 50% +1 of the total electorate required for a change.
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Re: Vote early, vote often.

Post by Big-al »

big mervyn wrote: Tue May 24, 2022 4:36 pm
Big-al wrote: Tue May 24, 2022 3:55 pm I’m not opposed of one. There has been a consistent 60/40 split on it since the 90’s. Nothing positive will come of it. It will cause further division in society.
Further division :lol: It's not going away. Imo it should be a mandatory question on every census. Only problem with that is there are to be no more censuses I believe? :lol: You'd thing that plural would be censi wouldn't you?

Votes on the constitutional position should be compulsory albeit with an option to abstain. Should have been with Brexit and should be with this. 50% +1 of the total electorate required for a change.
There is a long way to go before 50% of NI voted to leave the UK.

You’re deluded if you think a country can flourish with an election happening every so often on whether or not to be governed by Dublin or in Belfast/London.

Opinion Polls suggest that between 30-35% want a UI. SF know this and are spouting this nonsense to appease their voters that they are following the right path.
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Re: Vote early, vote often.

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You can't really have a vote on a united Ireland until you have answers to some of the big questions that would ensue, would there be a Stormont, is Southern Ireland prepared to take on NI's proportion of UK's debt, what would be the consequences for all the civil service jobs in NI etc. Regardless of whether NI is part of Britain or part of a United Ireland there will always be strife in the north unfortunately.
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Re: Vote early, vote often.

Post by BR »

Not only do you have to answer those questions, you have to pass enabling legislation in Dublin and London (with associated referendum for any constitutional changes).

Not that I, personally was caught out the last time, but I've no intention of voting for something vague like the phrase 'United Ireland' and a promise from someone with zero authority painted on the side of a bus.
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Re: Vote early, vote often.

Post by rumncoke »

The big big question for the southern public is are they willing to place themselves in a position where they might be at the mercy ( financially ) of Westminster and or the EU to subsidise the the absorption of the 6 counties -- the public purse -- employed and unemployed -- Civil Service - NHS -- Local Government -- the pensions -and benefits which are now paid by the British tax payer .

The question for those in the North is do they trust those now living in the PALE to continue to have the current levels of public sector employment -- Civil Service, NHS etc the fact is that many of those who would be asked to and expected to vote for an united Ireland are reliant on those jobs ( all be many of them are not the top jobs )

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big mervyn
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Re: Vote early, vote often.

Post by big mervyn »

The NHS certainly is hardly the big attraction it once was.
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Re: Vote early, vote often.

Post by Dublin4 »

You seem to be assuming that the Republic would vote for a united Ireland. If it means our taxes have to go up to pay for it, then a positive outcome would be very much in doubt. My fear is that the UK is gradually coming apart at the seams, the Scottish problem, the dawning on people of what Brexit really means, even the future of the monarchy, one party rule at Westminster etc. Northern Ireland has been destabilised ever since the dumb Brexit vote.
The growing middle ground may decide at some point to jump ship and wish to reenter the EU by joining with us. If that were to happen then NI would continue to have Stormont and to run its own local affairs, including the NHS. We moan down here about our health service but it's actually not much different from yours, in reality.
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Re: Vote early, vote often.

Post by Lurgan Lad »

Dublin4 wrote: Wed May 25, 2022 12:32 pm You seem to be assuming that the Republic would vote for a united Ireland. If it means our taxes have to go up to pay for it, then a positive outcome would be very much in doubt. My fear is that the UK is gradually coming apart at the seams, the Scottish problem, the dawning on people of what Brexit really means, even the future of the monarchy, one party rule at Westminster etc. Northern Ireland has been destabilised ever since the dumb Brexit vote.
The growing middle ground may decide at some point to jump ship and wish to reenter the EU by joining with us. If that were to happen then NI would continue to have Stormont and to run its own local affairs, including the NHS. We moan down here about our health service but it's actually not much different from yours, in reality.
To be honest I'm not really seeing a lot of what you are seeing.
I don't think too many on this thread are assuming the south would vote for a United Ireland, frankly they would be mad to do that. Why have to deal with the loonies in the north?
I do see things are more divisive these days, but I don't see the UK coming apart at the seams. Unless I am mistaken in any elections pro unionist parties in Scotland have consistently garnered more votes, I do wonder are the regional assemblies really fair without a devolved English one and just where it would end. I see no signs of Wales looking to leave the UK?
Brexit to me was never a dumb vote, there are a lot of people with sincere concerns in both Britain and all countries of the EU about the direction it is going.
I don't know what the growing middle ground wishing to reenter the EU means truth be told? Are you talking about Northern Ireland or the United Kingdom and what does it look like?
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Re: Vote early, vote often.

Post by Dublin4 »

What I mean about Brexit is that you got a very hard Brexit with GB leaving the Single Market and the Customs Union. I always remember the leader of the Brexiteers, Damien Hannan saying beforehand "certainly there is no question of leaving the Single Market."
That turned out to be untrue.

By the middle ground, I would regard the Alliance Party as your middle ground. They seem to be growing.
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Re: Vote early, vote often.

Post by jean valjean »

Dublin4 wrote:What I mean about Brexit is that you got a very hard Brexit with GB leaving the Single Market and the Customs Union. I always remember the leader of the Brexiteers, Damien Hannan saying beforehand "certainly there is no question of leaving the Single Market."
That turned out to be untrue.

By the middle ground, I would regard the Alliance Party as your middle ground. They seem to be growing.
While the middle ground is growing I don't think membership of the EU will be a key driver in many ls decisions on a United Ireland.

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big mervyn
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Re: Vote early, vote often.

Post by big mervyn »

jean valjean wrote: Thu May 26, 2022 11:46 am
Dublin4 wrote:What I mean about Brexit is that you got a very hard Brexit with GB leaving the Single Market and the Customs Union. I always remember the leader of the Brexiteers, Damien Hannan saying beforehand "certainly there is no question of leaving the Single Market."
That turned out to be untrue.

By the middle ground, I would regard the Alliance Party as your middle ground. They seem to be growing.
While the middle ground is growing I don't think membership of the EU will be a key driver in many ls decisions on a United Ireland.

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It changed my constitutional position.
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Re: Vote early, vote often.

Post by solidarity »

jean valjean wrote: Thu May 26, 2022 11:46 am
Dublin4 wrote:What I mean about Brexit is that you got a very hard Brexit with GB leaving the Single Market and the Customs Union. I always remember the leader of the Brexiteers, Damien Hannan saying beforehand "certainly there is no question of leaving the Single Market."
That turned out to be untrue.

By the middle ground, I would regard the Alliance Party as your middle ground. They seem to be growing.
While the middle ground is growing I don't think membership of the EU will be a key driver in many ls decisions on a United Ireland.

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Re: Vote early, vote often.

Post by Lurgan Lad »

Dublin4 wrote: Thu May 26, 2022 11:20 am What I mean about Brexit is that you got a very hard Brexit with GB leaving the Single Market and the Customs Union. I always remember the leader of the Brexiteers, Damien Hannan saying beforehand "certainly there is no question of leaving the Single Market."
That turned out to be untrue.

By the middle ground, I would regard the Alliance Party as your middle ground. They seem to be growing.
Thanks for coming back, are you suggesting that rejoining the EU could be an NI decision?
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