Ireland ? in New Zealand

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rumncoke
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Re: Ireland ? in New Zealand

Post by rumncoke »

Dr West the problem lies in the laws of the game and how they are applied

The Laws as applied encourage the ball carrier to confront a would be tackler by allowing him to run at the would be tackler ,the ball carrier can then ward off the would be carrier with shoulders and forearms to the body and face . Where as the laws only allow the ball carrier to actually hand off a would be tackler .

The most dangerous tackle to perform is a low head on tackle with the most common injuries to the tackler being either to the head or shoulders and the tackle fails to smother a pass or off load which is frequently essential in the modern game.

Until the ball carrier is punished for a failure to attempt a hand off then confrontational rugby will continue and head to head contact occur .

The fact that a hand on shoulder from behind, without contact to neck, can be considered a dangerous tackle shows how insane the laws have become as applied by referees since the first place any chasing player will make contact with is going to be a shoulder.

Then consider the England v Australia game a player gets sent off for a mock head butt with minimum contact after getting his hair pulled and the player guilty of the hair pull remains on the pitch or on saturday last a from row forward land on a scrum half forearm deliberately striking the back of the head and then forcefully applied to the scrumhalfs throat without a card being shown basically a blind eye is being applied to thuggery .

And why because the Laws as applied encourage confrontation .
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Dublin4
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Re: Ireland ? in New Zealand

Post by Dublin4 »

It seems that World Rugby has concluded that Peyper missed a lot on Saturday that would have favoured Ireland. The failure of Peyper to miss that he should have called uncontested scrums was remarkable. The apparent incompetence of the NZ officials in managing the situation when they had red and yellow cards was also notable.
World Rugby has concluded that Carbery should have been awarded a penalty try, I guess in the first test.
I suppose all's well that ends well but the quality of the decision making seems to be pretty poor. I hope they get it better for the last test.
Jetstream
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Re: Ireland ? in New Zealand

Post by Jetstream »

WestDr wrote: Mon Jul 11, 2022 11:17 am These days any report, whether in a 'quality' newspaper such as the Irish Times, or the 'boards' (e.g. the 42), seems to spend almost as long claiming red/yellow cards were missed and/or warranted than actually report on the points scoring activity. There also seems to be a tendency that Leinster lost only due to refereeing deficiencies and failures (cf reports on matches v La Rochelle and Bulls). It matters not whether it's an English, SA, French, Georgian or Martian referee. And only politeness stops the complaints about Hollie Davidson and Joy Neville.

Tbh, only Adam McKendry (formerly of this board) is worth reading and doesn't see his primary task as generating click-bait.

Munster supporters went through that phase a few years back although they do seem to have clocked that the reason they now lose is because of their own failures and deficiences. Ian Foster looks like he's starting on that journey too.....
The Irish Times is no longer a quality paper and reporters such as Thornley are merely going through the motions. As for the 42 with its main rugby writer Doyle(ex News of the World) it is mainly clickbait that spends its time winding up the Leinster and Munster fan base by setting one set of fans off against the other. Today's main article claims that Sexton is the GOAT(greatest of all time). It is worth noting that most posters on the 42 have never donned a jockstrap in their lives and are fair weather supporters. If you mentioned Jack Kyle or Moss Keane or Phil O'Callaghan to them they wouldn't know what you are talking about.
As for the Provinces, the Munster fans have become a bit more realistic over the last few years being brought down to earth by a lack of success. Thank Goodness they have stopped the BS about 'Irish by birth, Munster by the grace of God'. Instead they passed on the arrogance banner to the Leinster supporters. The Connacht fans of course have a permanent chip on their shoulders, claiming to be under funded and under represented on the Irish team. If you go by them they should have at least 10 in the panel.
The Ulster fans are the most humble of all. Then we have a lot to be humble about.
Bobbievee
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Re: Ireland ? in New Zealand

Post by Bobbievee »

The worrying aspect is that it is not just our views on rugby that are being manipulated by the modern maelstrom of uninformed and biased media covetage. Where do we turn for "quality" objective reporting of a match.........or politics.
Even commentating ( of which there is far too much), often sets out with an agenda ( as each specialist tries to confirm that the view that he or she had already expressed in the pre match build up about 4 hours previously) is coming to fruition.
O, for the professionalism of Bill McClaren; the Scottish BBC commentator who even kept his objectivity as his son in law was scoring a try against England!
Bobbievee
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Re: Ireland ? in New Zealand

Post by Bobbievee »

Alan Lawson , 2 tries against England, 1976
Bobbievee
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Re: Ireland ? in New Zealand

Post by Bobbievee »

Back to topic; good to see Lowry and Mccloskey and Treadwell starting tomorrow, and Herring on the bench. Long way to go not to get a game. Trust they all enjoy the moment and come through safely against a very strong tackling team.
Again it will require strong refereeing to control Inherent Maori brutality both in defence and attack
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HammerTime
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Re: Ireland ? in New Zealand

Post by HammerTime »

Lowry and McL quiet but not seeing much ball. Big Treadwell having a cracker so far.
SUFTUM_19
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Re: Ireland ? in New Zealand

Post by SUFTUM_19 »

Much more comfortable win than the score line suggests, a way better performance from last time out. From an Ulster POV, O’Toole played fairly well, nothing flashy but held up the scrum, made his tackles and played 75 mins. Treadwell and Timoney were excellent - Treadz with a brilliant steal 5m from the NZ line which eventually lead to our second try, Timoney took his try well and won a few key turnovers.

McCloskey and Lowry were both quiet but solid, neither really had much of an opportunity to light it up in the way we’ve seen them for Ulster but defensively they were pretty good. McCloskey threw a lovely pass for Larmours second try. Herring didn’t get on.
kUD
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Re: Ireland ? in New Zealand

Post by kUD »

I wonder if McCloskey has done enough to bench at #23 on Saturday. Assuming Aki and Henshaw start, will 23 be a centre or an outside back given Carberry at 22 can cover FB showing Keenan to the wind is required?
SUFTUM_19
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Re: Ireland ? in New Zealand

Post by SUFTUM_19 »

23 will be Earls
rumncoke
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Re: Ireland ? in New Zealand

Post by rumncoke »

stuff

Correct about Earls McL is never a bench player he either starts or sits in the stands. A jack of all positions is best for the bench especially in the backs -- back replacements tend to injury based rather than stamina based or tactical thus the need of for two specialists scrum -half and out half and a JOAP.

The other comment isa flawed assessment the score flatters Ireland to some extent the MABs lacked a kicker missed a couple and tried to convert line out penalties instead of taking the points.

MAB change of fullback was a mistake and as a result the they failed to run the the return with the same success as they had done in the previous game.

Where Ireland came out on top was mentally and Lamours ' first try was a killer in that respect with the added penalty points for anything in front of the posts putting pressure on the MABs.

Good display by the Ulstermen with Treadwell making some think again about his worth on the pitch .
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rumncoke
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Re: Ireland ? in New Zealand

Post by rumncoke »

to-day saw another stupid red card to the MABs winger based to could he have recovered the ball ( bullshit ) the card is for a deliberate knock on not an imperfect incomplete attempt at an intercept .

Do you believe it was a deliberate knock on or an attempted intercept the knock -on the ball is normally hit with force forward or down an intercept the ball is hit less hard and up . whether it is recovered depends as much on the weight of the pass and the timing of the run but failure recover the ball does not make it a deliberate knock on .
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UlsterNo9
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Re: Ireland ? in New Zealand

Post by UlsterNo9 »

rumncoke wrote: Tue Jul 12, 2022 1:57 pm to-day saw another stupid red card to the MABs winger based to could he have recovered the ball ( bullshit ) the card is for a deliberate knock on not an imperfect incomplete attempt at an intercept .

Do you believe it was a deliberate knock on or an attempted intercept the knock -on the ball is normally hit with force forward or down an intercept the ball is hit less hard and up . whether it is recovered depends as much on the weight of the pass and the timing of the run but failure recover the ball does not make it a deliberate knock on .
If they're giving red cards for that Rum I'll have to agree with you
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Dublin4
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Re: Ireland ? in New Zealand

Post by Dublin4 »

It was a yellow card he dished out, not a red.
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solidarity
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Re: Ireland ? in New Zealand

Post by solidarity »

IMO Timony and TOT were good, Treadwell and McCluskey were fine but Lowry didn't do his reputation much good at all.
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