Dharper wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2023 10:12 am
***to add:
The league pts/league position is pretty decent considering injuries, poor set piece (partially responsible for ineffectiveness in attack - platform). Let’s be honest we could finish 1st, would anyone be confident of a home knockout win? I’d take where we are, with the bonuses of seeing the pups get exposure.
Fully agree Payne has been a big loss. Super defender, and so intelligent in attack. Hopefully with family ties, he may return one day.
Interesting to see what happens re coaching extension contracts.
I think of the 6 opponents we’ve played this season, 5 of them are currently in the top 8 in the league.
Sir Ivor wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2023 12:00 am
I thought our 6 and 8 were very good, as were the centres who tackled well all night. As has been said above Burns was badly missed.
It seems in every match we have players who either catch the ball or carry it trying to make a line break then get isolated because our players are not backing up in the numbers our opponents are. Is this due to lack of fitness or poor training? And why, in tough matches away from home does each of our many captains choose to kick to the corner instead of taking the three points?
Anyway, Shanahan, as usual, speeded things up when he came on and can pass better than either Cooney or Doak. It’s unfortunate that we need one of those two for kicking and neither can play anywhere else but 9.
Nail on the head. Doak apart from his kicking is an enormous liability and does not form any part in an intention to play speeded up rugby. He needs to go.
And why do UR think that virtually conceding league points against Connaught is any less damaging at the end of the season than getting nil points against Glasgow. Our rotation policy is run by cretins.
If we are going to use this season to rebuild , fair enough, but we do then need to more honestly rein in our expectations
Not sure why you’re ranting about Doak, he wasn’t the scrum half today.
I'm sure he can answer for himself, but it looked like a general point to me, not one specific to this match.
Cooney was no quicker at getting the ball away last night. Didn’t have much length in his clearance kicks and his pass was inaccurate, yet some posters still have a go at Doak, even though he was playing 10, a poisotion where he probably wouldn’t have been training in, given the original match day selection.
Dharper wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2023 10:12 am
***to add:
The league pts/league position is pretty decent considering injuries, poor set piece (partially responsible for ineffectiveness in attack - platform). Let’s be honest we could finish 1st, would anyone be confident of a home knockout win? I’d take where we are, with the bonuses of seeing the pups get exposure.
Fully agree Payne has been a big loss. Super defender, and so intelligent in attack. Hopefully with family ties, he may return one day.
Interesting to see what happens re coaching extension contracts.
I think of the 6 opponents we’ve played this season, 5 of them are currently in the top 8 in the league.
We’ve played pretty decent sides on form.
Connacht is the one that got away. I'd have seen a lbp as a triumph last night given the teams and availability
Sir Ivor wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2023 12:00 am
I thought our 6 and 8 were very good, as were the centres who tackled well all night. As has been said above Burns was badly missed.
It seems in every match we have players who either catch the ball or carry it trying to make a line break then get isolated because our players are not backing up in the numbers our opponents are. Is this due to lack of fitness or poor training? And why, in tough matches away from home does each of our many captains choose to kick to the corner instead of taking the three points?
Anyway, Shanahan, as usual, speeded things up when he came on and can pass better than either Cooney or Doak. It’s unfortunate that we need one of those two for kicking and neither can play anywhere else but 9.
Nail on the head. Doak apart from his kicking is an enormous liability and does not form any part in an intention to play speeded up rugby. He needs to go.
And why do UR think that virtually conceding league points against Connaught is any less damaging at the end of the season than getting nil points against Glasgow. Our rotation policy is run by cretins.
If we are going to use this season to rebuild , fair enough, but we do then need to more honestly rein in our expectations
Not sure if I'm in a minority of one, but I've actually quite liked the way Dan's been picking the teams so far this year. The changes week to week have been a bit more dramatic than is ideal given the number of injuries we've had, but other than the Connacht match young players are being given chances in fairly strong teams and have been giving a good account of themselves.
With the world cup there aren't any breaks between the start of the season and six nations, given people can't play every week you've a choice between rotating (as our 'cretins' have been doing) or sending second string sides to more matches á la what happened against Connacht. Given the long list of injuries, other than McCloskey the team put out tonight wasn't too far off the strongest we could field. What would you have done differently?
Going into the block of the current block of three games before Bath, there'd likely have been a strong temptation to try and bank 10 points with full strength sides against the Lions and Edinburgh, then send the 'A' team to Glasgow. With hindsight, purely in terms of league points that might have been a better approach, but I like the fact we're trying to be competitive in all of the games while also putting an emphasis on giving the youngsters a chance. With McCann, Timoney and Ewers are all unavailable I was pretty surprised to see McNabney being given a starting debut, but pleasantly so.
DFs hand has been forced to play the cubs in fairness MR, due to jnjury and a negative balance sheet, rather than some epiphany. He got the EOS/ AW choice wrong too imo.
At least with the injuries we're seeing who's capable of standing up from the Academy, and the contrast between them and the likes of Matty Rea and Jones, both poor Mens Robbie Diacks.
I add McIlroy and Moxham in there also, unfortunately as filler.
Sir Ivor wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2023 12:00 am
I thought our 6 and 8 were very good, as were the centres who tackled well all night. As has been said above Burns was badly missed.
It seems in every match we have players who either catch the ball or carry it trying to make a line break then get isolated because our players are not backing up in the numbers our opponents are. Is this due to lack of fitness or poor training? And why, in tough matches away from home does each of our many captains choose to kick to the corner instead of taking the three points?
Anyway, Shanahan, as usual, speeded things up when he came on and can pass better than either Cooney or Doak. It’s unfortunate that we need one of those two for kicking and neither can play anywhere else but 9.
Nail on the head. Doak apart from his kicking is an enormous liability and does not form any part in an intention to play speeded up rugby. He needs to go.
And why do UR think that virtually conceding league points against Connaught is any less damaging at the end of the season than getting nil points against Glasgow. Our rotation policy is run by cretins.
If we are going to use this season to rebuild , fair enough, but we do then need to more honestly rein in our expectations
Not sure why you’re ranting about Doak, he wasn’t the scrum half today.
I'm sure he can answer for himself, but it looked like a general point to me, not one specific to this match.
Cooney was no quicker at getting the ball away last night. Didn’t have much length in his clearance kicks and his pass was inaccurate, yet some posters still have a go at Doak, even though he was playing 10, a poisotion where he probably wouldn’t have been training in, given the original match day selection.
I refer the honourable gennulman to my previous answer.
I am neither arguing for or against wot you wrote, simply pointing out again, that the points already made were generalisations, not about last night's match.
But hey, perhaps we can all agree that finally Shanners is the appointed one - the Messiah - the Son of (the) Man, Pienaar?
No?
Oh, okay then.
I'm not arguing -
I'm just explaining why I'm right
CIMANFOREVER wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2023 10:35 am
DFs hand has been forced to play the cubs in fairness MR, due to jnjury and a negative balance sheet, rather than some epiphany. He got the EOS/ AW choice wrong too imo.
At least with the injuries we're seeing who's capable of standing up from the Academy, and the contrast between them and the likes of Matty Rea and Jones, both poor Mens Robbie Diacks.
I add McIlroy and Moxham in there also, unfortunately as filler.
To an extent, but not entirely. I doubt many here would have expected to see McCartney given a debut last night, when the safer choice would have been to pick Rea. Similarly giving Wilson his minutes at THP when Warwick could have been played out of position. I also like the fact Dan is giving a shot at ten, when in the last two seasons Billy Burns was being named in every team even when he was crocked.
Some more general, positive observations after round 6:
The league is getting better, some cracking games, four countries represented in the top eight, any of which could beat the others on their day. Wales a worry but Cardiff even won.
In the regular season, Ulster need, outside of finishing in top eight, which is definitely not a given but also very attainable, to focus on getting ready for knock out rugby, so the squad and heads need to be right, so for me the young homebred tyros need to play. Young McNabney had an outstanding debut. I still think we need a ten though.
For the first time, both my heart and mind are putting Europe second to league progression, especially with what ERC have done to the old, blessed tournament that was the Heineken Cup.
Chris Busby getting rightly praised for his refereeing, well done.
McNabney was superb. Just pumps the legs and makes ground. Hopefully he and hopes can fill out a bit like McCann has. Finally some serious Ulster born forward prospects knocking on the door although equally plenty of time for Ulster to ruin them. Dan gurning about the ref but when you stop playing the rugby you stop winning the penalties. Ulster exploded out of the blocks and Glasgow couldn't cope. Big turning point for me was we were going for a third try and Addison gets pinged for crossing 10 metres from the Glasgow line. After that we went into our shells and it was all Glasgow. Ulster getting penalised all over the show. For all Stewarts talent he needs to cut out the braindead mistakes and penalties. O'Sullivan, in the loose anyway seems to have improved. Burns dare I say it was missed massively when he went off. Franco Smith seems to be a helluva coach.
CIMANFOREVER wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2023 10:35 am
DFs hand has been forced to play the cubs in fairness MR, due to jnjury and a negative balance sheet, rather than some epiphany. He got the EOS/ AW choice wrong too imo.
At least with the injuries we're seeing who's capable of standing up from the Academy, and the contrast between them and the likes of Matty Rea and Jones, both poor Mens Robbie Diacks.
I add McIlroy and Moxham in there also, unfortunately as filler.
To an extent, but not entirely. I doubt many here would have expected to see McCartney given a debut last night, when the safer choice would have been to pick Rea. Similarly giving Wilson his minutes at THP when Warwick could have been played out of position. I also like the fact Dan is giving a shot at ten, when in the last two seasons Billy Burns was being named in every team even when he was crocked.
AW to TH was never a real option given the injury profiles. I just hope Wilson is given more chances with rotation
HammerTime wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2023 5:22 pm
McNabney was superb. Just pumps the legs and makes ground. Hopefully he and hopes can fill out a bit like McCann has. Finally some serious Ulster born forward prospects knocking on the door although equally plenty of time for Ulster to ruin them. Dan gurning about the ref but when you stop playing the rugby you stop winning the penalties. Ulster exploded out of the blocks and Glasgow couldn't cope. Big turning point for me was we were going for a third try and Addison gets pinged for crossing 10 metres from the Glasgow line. After that we went into our shells and it was all Glasgow. Ulster getting penalised all over the show. For all Stewarts talent he needs to cut out the braindead mistakes and penalties. O'Sullivan, in the loose anyway seems to have improved. Burns dare I say it was missed massively when he went off. Franco Smith seems to be a helluva coach.
I think McNabney is only 20/21 so I'd say he will definitely fill out but I was impressed by him against that Glasgow pack -he did really well.
The bright start and then falling away - I think/hope that is down to squad rotation and new systems bedding in still but being disrupted by injuries. But great to see the young guys get a chance and showing what they can do.
Despite the way things went in the second half, on reflection I’m positive about how things are going. Young guys being introduced and given good exposure to tough opponents, and they are showing up well; Ewers, Timoney & McCann a good back row; Hume seems to have re-discovered his form; Kitshoff & M Moore will greatly help the scrum and other aspects of play; if we can keep Flannery & Burns fit we should have prospects of better attacking play; Lowry still to come back; Herring & McCloskey missing in Glasgow but will be back; with better service Stockdale & Balacoune should see improvement.
It's the one-man attacks, especially close to the line that get me. Why can they not attack in pods and get that extra initial oomph and then support to avoid getting isolated?
And, of course, the silly handling errors.
I think we are actually really close to being really good.
Sir Ivor wrote: ↑Sun Nov 26, 2023 12:00 am
I thought our 6 and 8 were very good, as were the centres who tackled well all night. As has been said above Burns was badly missed.
It seems in every match we have players who either catch the ball or carry it trying to make a line break then get isolated because our players are not backing up in the numbers our opponents are. Is this due to lack of fitness or poor training? And why, in tough matches away from home does each of our many captains choose to kick to the corner instead of taking the three points?
Anyway, Shanahan, as usual, speeded things up when he came on and can pass better than either Cooney or Doak. It’s unfortunate that we need one of those two for kicking and neither can play anywhere else but 9.
Nail on the head. Doak apart from his kicking is an enormous liability and does not form any part in an intention to play speeded up rugby. He needs to go.
And why do UR think that virtually conceding league points against Connaught is any less damaging at the end of the season than getting nil points against Glasgow. Our rotation policy is run by cretins.
If we are going to use this season to rebuild , fair enough, but we do then need to more honestly rein in our expectations
Not sure why you’re ranting about Doak, he wasn’t the scrum half today.
I'm sure he can answer for himself, but it looked like a general point to me, not one specific to this match.
Gonna have to watch the game back but from where I was freezing to death, it was quite a challenging evening.
That’s save the first 15 minutes which was the most surreal passage of one-way traffic I think I’ve ever seen.
Around the time the single malt wore off, or was it when Addison got done for crossing, there was only one team in it.
The period of play before half time when they kept messing up the lineout, stopping us from exiting, getting a pen and repeating the process for what seemed like forever was irritating.
It took until Glasgow had become dominant before the bloke next to me felt able to speak and he was civil enough tbh.
That was, predictably, as warm as our welcome got at the ground, in stark contrast to the city centre which was, as ever, pretty good fun.
NB Should a bunch of kids start hurling chips at you in the small hours, adopting the position of an expectant slip fielder defuses any potential tension.
Just one wee whinge; I was at the game at the weekend and not for the first time there was no acknowledgement of travelling away fans after the game by any players. Same at the previous away game I was at (Leinster at the Aviva in April when we got soaked to the skin).
I'm not looking a medal for going but away travel isnt cheap these days to support your team. Wendyballers make a point of doing it
