Dan’s Not the Man.

[CIMANFOREVER]

I wonder would Aki, JGP, Hansen and Lowe et al have flourished under recent Ulster coaching tickets had they had this misfortune to end up here? They landed on these shores essentially as glorified journeymen and have been improved. Compare and contrast our mob who, at best, get a sympathy cap for the middle Autumn International. Would Stockdale Hume or McCloskey have faired better in Dublin? Can anyone honestly say they wouldn't have?

I

We wouldn't have identified the talent in the first place. Case in point when Bealham landed in Belfast trying to secure a trial or something to that effect.

Bealham was the closest thing to an Ulsterman in France. I believe he qualified through a Fermanagh granny. Wonder why he isn't in the 23 for Wales?

I understand that Bealham was in and around the Ulster set up in 2010/2011 when he first came across from Australia. However he was not offered a place in the Academy but was later picked up by Connacht who offered him a place in their academy where he flourished. When in Belfast I understand Bealham may have been playing for Belfast Harlequin 2s ; I hope the Connacht talent scout got a big bonus !!!

Face didn't fit til he moved.....

[Sir Ivor]

I heard a comment on tv I think, or maybe I dreamt it, that Ulster did not finish lower than fourth in the league in the six years Dan was in charge. Could someone with all the stats advise if that is true please?

If it is true could fans say what level of performance they expect from the incoming head coach, whoever that is. I suppose they’ll have to finish at least second or maybe third each year to avoid the abuse heaped on the likes of Dan, Kiss, Anscombe, Doak and Clarke, Williams and most of all, McCall.

[Neill_M]

I heard a comment on tv I think, or maybe I dreamt it, that Ulster did not finish lower than fourth in the league in the six years Dan was in charge. Could someone with all the stats advise if that is true please?

If it is true could fans say what level of performance they expect from the incoming head coach, whoever that is. I suppose they’ll have to finish at least second or maybe third each year to avoid the abuse heaped on the likes of Dan, Kiss, Anscombe, Doak and Clarke, Williams and most of all, McCall.

So for 2018/19 - 2020/21, it was a two conference system and Ulster finished 2nd in their conference behind Leinster.

In the URC era, finished 3rd in 2021/22 and 2nd in 2022/23.

[allezlesverres]

I heard a comment on tv I think, or maybe I dreamt it, that Ulster did not finish lower than fourth in the league in the six years Dan was in charge. Could someone with all the stats advise if that is true please?

If it is true could fans say what level of performance they expect from the incoming head coach, whoever that is. I suppose they’ll have to finish at least second or maybe third each year to avoid the abuse heaped on the likes of Dan, Kiss, Anscombe, Doak and Clarke, Williams and most of all, McCall.

In Dan's era the rugby World invented a new verb "to ulster" which means the same thing as plucking defeat from the jaws of victory. It is used beyond these shores now and its absolutely mortifying. Its worse because its a fair observation. If we can stop or at least reduce the amount of games we ulster I'll count the next coach a success.

[So It Is]

I'm in work so don't have the time to look myself, but could one of our workshy contributors count the number of games we've Ulstered in the last 2 years by lunchtime for our review?

Much appreciated.

[justinr73]

Not surprised by this news, he had been there too long and as per my stats earlier in the thread things were on the slide last season and most definitely this season.

Interesting to see if if we see a similar "new manager bounce" as from football, when a coach is fired and the same players who couldn't beat eggs magically raise their games once the old coach is gone.

Doesn’t seem to happen as much these days and certainly not in the Championship this season.

Mildly interesting update.

The thirteen teams in the Championship (ie the old second division in English football) who have changed their manager this season currently occupy the bottom thirteen places in the table.

[Dave]

Not surprised by this news, he had been there too long and as per my stats earlier in the thread things were on the slide last season and most definitely this season.

Interesting to see if if we see a similar "new manager bounce" as from football, when a coach is fired and the same players who couldn't beat eggs magically raise their games once the old coach is gone.

Doesn’t seem to happen as much these days and certainly not in the Championship this season.

Mildly interesting update.

The thirteen teams in the Championship (ie the old second division in English football) who have changed their manager this season currently occupy the bottom thirteen places in the table.

Birmingham city sacked two managers. The were 6th with John Eustace in charge. Now they are in the relegation zone.

[justinr73]

Not surprised by this news, he had been there too long and as per my stats earlier in the thread things were on the slide last season and most definitely this season.

Interesting to see if if we see a similar "new manager bounce" as from football, when a coach is fired and the same players who couldn't beat eggs magically raise their games once the old coach is gone.

Doesn’t seem to happen as much these days and certainly not in the Championship this season.

Mildly interesting update.

The thirteen teams in the Championship (ie the old second division in English football) who have changed their manager this season currently occupy the bottom thirteen places in the table.

Birmingham city sacked two managers. The were 6th with John Eustace in charge. Now they are in the relegation zone.

Annoyingly, they brought in Gary Rowett just before they played Preston who hadn’t lost in 12 games against us.

He promptly hypnotised our centre half to fall over and made it 13.

[CIMANFOREVER]

So Dan was innocent? Shall we bring him back? The team fell off the cliff noticeably in the last 18 months under his reign and there was an obviously pervasive undercurrent that highlighted the seemingly terminal tailspin we were in added to the fact that Petrie et Al had p#ssed over £1m debt up the wall by management ineptitude.

Sometimes a scorched earth policy is the only option for green shoots. The fact we are offloading " marquee " players is symptomatic of the deep shyte we're in. The rebuild starts with the coach, Petrie and hopefully Cunningham going. If Murphy is anointed, then he HAS to have his own coaching team, not the dross he has inherited to be fair to him, but can we afford it?

This is a long rebuild and We may not have bottomed out yet.
Murphy needs a preseason to put his stamp on. Atm this is firefighting. Some good cubs need the space to develop, and players like JS, RB etc need to now earn their substantial corn, otherwise people will vote with their feet, and the tailspin will make us an Irish version of the Dragons

[justinr73]

I don’t think anyone’s arguing that (yet) but there’s certainly evidence that the new boss bounce isn’t a thing anymore.

To some extent, it probably speaks to the fact that the gap between the haves and the have nots is wider than it used to be.

[Yoda]

To some extent, it probably speaks to the fact that the gap between the haves and the have nots is wider than it used to be.

Yes re the gaps - at the end of their weekend Champions Cup coverage I think it was ITV who were saying how great it was that over 50 points were scored in all 4 quarter finals and three of them were over 80. However only one of those games was actually close - I don't see it as a good thing that three of the supposedly best 8 teams in the competition are nothing more than a speed bump to their opposition.

[Dave]

To some extent, it probably speaks to the fact that the gap between the haves and the have nots is wider than it used to be.

Yes re the gaps - at the end of their weekend Champions Cup coverage I think it was ITV who were saying how great it was that over 50 points were scored in all 4 quarter finals and three of them were over 80. However only one of those games was actually close - I don't see it as a good thing that three of the supposedly best 8 teams in the competition are nothing more than a speed bump to their opposition.

If we found a gap. We would butcher it with a loopy pass.

[UlsterAreBrill]

I see mention on Twatter today that Payne may be coming back

[Big-al]

He’d be a good addition.

People can say what they like about him, but he had a positive role as a coach when here. As good an impact as any and I’m starting to wonder where those criticising his attitude a bit jealous of his relative success?

[justinr73]

I see mention on Twatter today that Payne may be coming back

Twatter gets precious little correct.

However, Payne was considered and subsequently overlooked for the Leinster role and can’t be too keen on staying at Scarlets…