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ballpark
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Post by ballpark »

Cockatrice wrote: In the absence of an explanation I do feel that this will hamper any desires to reach into the rugby and football worlds here.
Of course football and rugby have went the other way and reached into the world of terrorist commemoration by proxy when they accepted that they may play their sports at the site of the Maze, a location that is indelibly branded with the hunger strike issue first and foremost and a sports stadium location a distant second.

So whilst some Ulster rugby fans may be critical/uneasy of O'Neills, should they tap into the Ulster rugby market with the authority of UR.

Remember UR got there first when they tacitly accepted relocating to the Maze.
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Post by Cockatrice »

BP- There is indeed the argument that by supporting the citing of the new stadium at the Maze that one may in some small way be providing support for years of terrorism.

The stadium could only be approved for the Maze on receipt of all party support and from some quarters this required that part of the former prison namely the hospital block and at least one H Block were included. Hence the seemingly unbreakable link that for us to get a sporting stadium others must first get their conflict resolution centre (terrorist museum) and that one will not be built without the other. It also appears to have been the case that assurances had to be given in certain quarters that the actual playing pitch would fall outside the area of what was the prison or agin support would be withdrawn.

Since then we have all sorts of dressing up of issues to ensure that the Maze turned out to be the most suitable site for any stadium.

The government appear willing to spend over £100M of our money on a project just to ensure that the Maze conflict resolution centre gets built. I suspect that like many other places around this country it will soon become a shrine to its former past.

It was interesting that it was Jeffrey Donaldson that made mention of the Hunger Striker shirts being on sale and linking them to terrorism whilst at the same time I have not heard his comment on the link between the stadium and the museum both of which fall into his Lagan Valley constituency.

It is the Government that made this issue political and whilst there are many other financial reason for putting up an argument we shouldn’t lose sight of the fact that without the museum we wouldn’t be getting a stadium.
Last edited by Cockatrice on Wed Jul 19, 2006 10:58 am, edited 1 time in total.
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colinh
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Post by colinh »

A bulldozer could sort that one out.
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Post by ding dong2u »

Must be some unused Semtex knockin' about :roll:
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Post by ballpark »

CT- I agree with what you say, but for many setting aside the minutae for one minute, few will be as well versed as yourself and consider that the name The Maze will alone be enough to draw attention to what is a highly emotive name for people in the Province over the past 30 years.

Building the pitch outside the perimeter of the prison only serves to highlight the ambiguity that surrounds this location obstensibly to be used for the location of a sports stadium but in reality the purposeful interweaving of our troubled past with sporting tradition. A plague on it.

In respect of the above issue and the shirt, UR will hardly be able to turn O'Neill's overtures for kit supply down on the grounds that they manufactured and outlet sale of a shirt commemorating the hunger strike, when UR has already lent it's name by proxy to accommodating the memory of those same hunger strikers by agreeing tacitly to relocate to the Maze.


In the interests of the sanity of the insane who frequent the Back Room this topic and gone and become way too serious for that forum so I have moved it. Complaints on a postcard to me if necessary. Ill not read it but it might make you feel better. And it has gone off topic as well.
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Post by Cockatrice »

BP- I accept that many are not versed in the detail of who and what the Hunger Strikers were about and that in this time of so called peace we should leave that behind us and move forward. However given that it is a condition of support for the stadium that a museum on the same site must contain the hospital in which they died and a block in which they were imprisoned will IMHO always inexplictedly link the two.

Maybe it is an age thing that having lived through the troubles losing friends and relatives along the way that I have a somewhat blinkered view. These men like many others on both sides may consider themselves freedom fighers but for law abiding citizens they were no more than murderers.

Off topic and I apologise in advance but for those not aware of the men that must be honoured to ensure that a stadium is built I enclose a summery for your information.

Bobby Sands, Belfast, Provisional IRA - In 1972 he joined the PIRA and was later that same year was arrested and convicted of taking part in several IRA robberies.

On his release in 1976 he was involved in the bombing of the Balmoral Furniture Company in Dunmurry. After the bombing, Sands and at least 5 others in the bomb team, were involved in a gun battle with the police. Abandoning two of their wounded friends, Seamus Martin and Gabriel Corbett , Sands with Joe McDonnell, Seamus Finucane and Sean Lavery, tried to escape in a car, but were caught. Sands had one of the revolvers used in the shooting in his possession.

His trial saw him accused of organising a bombing which had happened nearby, but these and other serious charges against him were dismissed for lack of evidence. He was convicted of possession of firearms of a revolver from which bullets had been fired at the police after the bombing and sentenced to 14 years' imprisonment.

Francis Hughes, Bellaghy, PIRA - He was captured on 17 March 1978 near Maghera in County Derry after a gun battle with the SAS. A member of the SAS, David Jones, was killed in the gun battle, and another SAS member was seriously wounded. Hughes was wounded in the leg. He managed to crawl away but was pursued and he surrendered.

In February 1980 following his capture, he was sentenced to a total of 83 years in prison he was tried for, and found guilty of, the murder of one soldier (for which he received a life sentence) and wounding of another (for which he received 14 years) in the incident which led to his capture, as well as a a series of gun and bomb attacks over a six-year period.

Patsy O’Hara, Derry, INLA - He was caught in possession of a hand grenade in May 1979 and was convicted and sentenced to eight years in January 1980.

Raymond McCreesh, Camlough, PIRA – Was part of a team that opened fire on soldiers moving to investigate suspicious activity. Left behind he tried to hide in a farmhouse with others but was surrounded and after they failed to shoot their way out the local Roman Catholic parish priest facilitated their surrender. One of the soldiers who captured them, Lance Corporal David Jones was later murdered by Francis Hughes.

In March 1977, Raymond McCreesh was convicted and sentenced to fourteen years in prison for attempted murder, possession of a rifle and ammunition and IRA membership.

Joe McDonnell, Belfast, PIRA, - With Bobby Sands in the run up to an IRA firebomb attack on the Balmoral Furnishing Company. During the ensuing shootout between the IRA and the British Authorities (The RUC and British Army) both men along with Séamas Finucane and Seán Lavery were captured.

Despite only one revolver being found between the men all were sentenced to 14 years in prison after none of them accepted the Jurisdiction of the court

Martin Hurson, Cappagh, PIRA - In November 1976, Hurson together with Kevin O’Brien, Dermot Boyle, Peter Kane and Pat O’Neil were arrested. Martin Hurson was tried and convicted of involvement in three IRA landmine incidents, one at Cappagh in September and one at Galbally in November 1975 and a third at Reclain in February 1976 when several members of the RUC narrowly escaped death.

He was sentenced to concurrent sentences of twenty, fifteen and five years for these convictions.

Kevin Lynch, INLA, Dungiven, INLA - He was tried, convicted and sentenced to ten years for stealing shotguns, taking part in a punishment shooting and conspiring to take arms from the security forces.

Kieran Doherty, Belfast, PIRA -In August 1976, while out to set a bomb, the van he was in was chased by the police. During the chase Doherty managed to leave the van and hijack a car but was caught as he was escaping. He was convicted and sentenced to 18 years for possession of firearms and explosives, with another 4 years for the hijack.

Thomas McElwee, Bellaghy, PIRA - He was arrested for a firebomb attack in the town of Ballymena in which he was nearly blinded. After his recovery he was charged with murder of an Yvonne Dunlop, a 26 year old, who was killed when one of the bombs they had planted destroyed her shop the Alley Katz Boutique. On conviction for Yvonne’s murder, McElwee wase sentenced to life in September 1977, later reduced to 20 years.

Michael Devine, Derry, INLA - In September 1976 he and two others, Desmond Walmsley and John Cassidy, were caught with rifles, shotguns and 3,000 rounds of ammunition they had stolen in Lifford, Donegal. He was convicted and sentenced to 12 years for the theft and arms possession charges in 1977
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Post by The Fonz »

This thread has gone away off topic and serves no usefull purpose to continue in my eyes and is as therefore locked :evil:
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