Johnny foreigners

[fermain]

prompted from the shnoozeletter article, which said that "But one thing McCall did have was an Ulster side who played with a bit of pride in the jersey"
Do we really think that our foreign players know what it's about playin' for the red hand???
I mean professionals shouldn't care who they play for, but give their all, 'cause they're being paid for it, but to play for the red hand, not just the shirt?! I'm not sure they do!

[ColinM]

Well for them to learn what it means thay need to be taught by our homegrowns. I'm not sure there was enough of that going on, on or off the field.

[WhiteKnightoftheWeld]

well what exactly are they playing for? What does it mean to play for the red hand? what makes ulster rugby so special and unique?

- every club has fans who turn out to watch
- we're not unique in that we have homegrown players who stood on the terrace as kids
- we were better than we are presently, former glories and all that...

but what the feck do you mean when you're talking about playing for the red hand?
what will a caldwell for instance have told big ed when he came over last year?

[scrum5]

Well for them to learn what it means thay need to be taught by our homegrowns. I'm not sure there was enough of that going on, on or off the field.

might also have been due to the fact that we had a foreign coach....

[ColinM]

well what exactly are they playing for? What does it mean to play for the red hand? what makes ulster rugby so special and unique?

- every club has fans who turn out to watch
- we're not unique in that we have homegrown players who stood on the terrace as kids
- we were better than we are presently, former glories and all that...

but what the feck do you mean when you're talking about playing for the red hand?
what will a caldwell for instance have told big ed when he came over last year?

I think being a province makes it a bit different for the homegrowns, but agree for the blow ins its more of a club. Perhaps the province bit is wearing off in the professional era and its more of a club now where people come and people go if they fancy a change. But agree we're not unique, there's 4 of us in Ireland alone.

[Ardglass2]

I am as proud as anyone about Ulster as a rugby team but we are not that special

Munster, Biarritz, Leicester, Gloucester, Cardiff and many more have an identity that is as passionate. To believe otherwise is delusional

[fermain]

No, it's not a unique concept, but being an Ulsterman is! Theres only so many of us, and only the few who make the grade to play at the highest level have the priviledge of doing it for the rest! I could never support another team the same way... never, never, NEVER

[BPH]

Holy Christ. A very good WKOTW post that was sensible and 100% spot-on. I'm shocked

[Cap'n Grumpy]

We ARE unique ....... just like everyone else!

[BR]

Agree that lots of clubs/provinces have traditions, etc. and that in many cases those are taken from the local population. Now the one thing that Ulster (the population) has in spades (not spides) is bloody-mindedness, so I think we all appreciate when our team plays with a certain amount of that quality. For me that is what differentiates an ulster performance from an ULSTER performance.

[Bart S]

Do people really feel that Mark McCall's team, even when on the downard spiral "played with pride in the jersey?".

Did we not play with pride in the jersey at Thomond Park last season?

The players who showed most "pride in the jersey" last season IMHO were Paddy Wallace and Ed O'Donohue. There were certain born and bred Ulstermen who looked to be showing less pride in the jersey than some of the foreign players.

We're all Ulster fans and think that playing for Ulster is an honour but to say that the locals lads put in more effort than the foreigners is completely wrong IMHO.

As I've said elsewhere - results play a big part in whether peopel think there has been pride in the jersey.

[The Ulsterian]

I recall Matt Mustchin was interviewed, after he went to Edinburgh, about the Ulster team and he commented on their pride and passion, it was along the lines of
' when Ulster boys pull on the jersey they are not playing for their club or for their province these boys think they are playing for their country'.
Hopefully the pride and passion displayed in those days will return.

[mikerob]

Is it really "pride in the jersey" anyway... or more to do with pride in the team and your own performance? In the military , I've heard it said that when it comes down it, its not about "Queen and country" but about not wanting to let down the guy beside you.

I also don't think attitude depends on where you come from. A homegrown player can be a big fish in a small pond and earning a lot more than his peers. That can lead to complacency and a sense of entitlement.. whereas the best of foreign pros know that the world doesn't owe them a living.

IMO the issue with Ulster in recent times has been a failure of basic skills under pressure and a mental attitude when the team never looked as if they thought they could win. Is this the same as a lack of pride in the jersey?

[ColinM]

' when Ulster boys pull on the jersey they are not playing for their club or for their province these boys think they are playing for their country'.

Thats displayed on the dressing room wall in Ravers

[Cap'n Grumpy]

' when Ulster boys pull on the jersey they are not playing for their club or for their province these boys think they are playing for their country'.

Thats displayed on the dressing room wall in Ravers

Matt Mustchin was always being told off for writing on the walls