NEW BOSS

[mikerob]

I didn't mean to imply that the UB should be "transparent and accountable" to me, as an ordinary punter, but I highly suspect that even within the UB/IRFU, it isn't that clear. Hence no mention of the professional management committee on the UB website, and the typical member of a rugby club will probably not have a clue as to how these people get to where they've got to.

[ulsterfan09]

Hi Sorry I have been away on leave for 10 days but back.

I agree with the most of the posts regarding the CV issue. Mr Logan may or may not have 'spiced' up the CV we will never know. Whats is really the issue is the shortlisting criteria that the IRFU outlined to attract the best candidates. The following appear on the application form:

A minimum of three in the last five years experience at a Senior Executive Level in a commercial organisation with turnover in excess of £5mm and showing increasing profitability (at the Chief Executive level).

Well the RNIB in NI are a charity, with only approx £100,000 turnover of commercial income and approx £1m of funding and donations per annum. These figures have never got above £2m per annum in 10 years. Mr Logan is the Regional Director I read from their web page and not Chief Executive as outlined earlier in these posts.

Also has he really managed 100 people or more, another criteria on the application form....

To me if I were the other two unsuccessful chaps I would be seriously pi**ed off with this and would question the validity of the appointment. Its like saying that the the private consultant surgeon you are paying for who will operate on you, has not done his time yet and does not have the quailifications to carry out the operation. Would you let me near you if you were paying for the surgery?

The IRFU have some serious questions to answer. They may be facing serious legal issues here if the other two chaps challenge this. Being from a legal background I would represent them, clear cut victory here, however i doubt if i will be asked. However UR have a bigger issue if one can be bigger than this. Do they suspend the appointment process and start again (risky option), keep Mr Logan and face the legal issues (most risk option) or do they appoint one of the two unsuccessful chaps (best option legally) as Mr Logan would have weak ground if his CV was not what it should have been and the other two could thus accept the process and the change one of them would be appointed. What a mess but hey thats what they paid a very Senior and Very Respected Recruitment Consultant.......he needs to earn his money now.

[cables]

Legal background chappie.

Also has he really managed 100 people or more, another criteria on the application form....

The information I can access says - "You will be able to demonstrate the ability to achieve success through managing teams of up to 100 people and at the same time being able to work within and lead through a Non-Executive Board or Committee environment."

You may have got this wrong. I suggest you check.

[ulsterfan09]

Yes I will check but looking at your post you may be right, however the 100 i there for a reason and legally it would get a stronger mark during shortlisting if one managed closer to the 100, this was third hand in fairness but the 1st criteria was i believe taken from the application form

[cables]

I will not contest your 'legal' view on shortlisting IF the criteria was "up to 100" but if you are correct then someone who put 101 or more on their CV would be outside the criteria? Yes?

It is always best to be able to stand over selection criteria based on the actual requirements of the job. UR currently would have 142'ish employees including players etc.

[ulsterfan09]

Thats a fair point and I know what you mean. However the focus is on the 1st point i have made. What are your views on this more serious and more definite issue based on what is now publically and unquestionably in the public domain?

[darkside lightside]

to mike's point, when i talk about 'transparency & accountability' i mean within the organisation, not to me, as an occasional customer and fan... that said, i think there would be some value in being a little more transparent with respect to the fans - if for no more reason than to give them comfort that stuff is getting dealt with competently...

[cables]

Thats a fair point and I know what you mean. However the focus is on the 1st point i have made. What are your views on this more serious and more definite issue based on what is now publically and unquestionably in the public domain?

I don't believe I have access to either UR/IRFU documentation on the application form and until I did I would not care to give my view.

[ulsterfan09]

I understand but you seemed to be able to quote one of the criteria very well in your earlier post, was this from the documentation?

[Snipe Watson]

Being from a legal background I would represent them.

Cracker

[mikerob]

The IRFU have some serious questions to answer. They may be facing serious legal issues here if the other two chaps challenge this

What would be the grounds to challenge the IRFU? If an unsuccessful candidate believes there has been race/age/religious/sex/disability discrimination then this is covered by the law but if the employer says "we think the successful candidate had the best interview", then what?

Taking legal action against a prospective employer isn't usually a good way of getting a job so if anyone did it, it would be just to get revenge rather than overturn a decision. If they thought they had been shafted, most people wouldn't want to work for the organisation anyway.

[cables]

I understand but you seemed to be able to quote one of the criteria very well in your earlier post, was this from the documentation?

No it was from the UR website "Job Opportunity" News item.

[Rooster]

The ad that appeared on UR site

Qualifications/Experience

•Potential candidates should be educated to degree level preferably in a business management or related discipline and be able to demonstrate a track record of growing a commercial organisation in a very competitive business environment.

•You will be able to demonstrate the ability to achieve success through managing teams of up to 100 people and at the same time being able to work within and lead through a Non-Executive Board or Committee environment.

•You will be an excellent communicator and be at ease presenting to outside investors, Government Departments and officials, the Press (both radio and TV) and to Branch & IRFU Committees and Staff.

•You will have the gravitas to command respect at the highest levels of sport, business and government while having the people skills to lead and enthuse a sizeable staff complement to excel in their support roles.

A substantial remuneration package is on offer reflecting the need to attract the best.

http://www.ulsterrugby.com/10672.php

There may however be differing criteria or more detailed at least on the full info pack.

[ulsterfan09]

Yes Rooster you are right, if one had downloaded the full application form then the criteria was clear and was what I quoted. I accept Cables point and the 100 people thing may not be as clear on the appication pack but i will check with my source tomorrow. Regarding what could be done, well the unsuccessful candidates could challenge as stated under employment legislation, however if this went to an Industrial Tribunal then the IT could award substantial damages against UR only to the two people. The issue of discrimination if any is open also and could be taken through the equality commission and would be a serious escalation but i dont know if this is an issue. However UR would have to ask itself from a credibility and reputational perspective continuing with this appointment if Mr Logan was appointed having failed to meet a mandatory criteria, would it be the best for UR if they got challenged and the challenges were upheld.

Also what about the other people who did not even get an interview because they 'did not make the criteria' they to have a case and then we could have some gents or ladies who could claim discrimination, this is something that would have a bigger impact..........

[ColinM]

Hi Sorry I have been away on leave for 10 days but back.

Strange how your last post was only a week ago