Manshamed....

[BaggyTrousers]

That performance tonight was nowhere near acceptable. I've been angry watching Rugby matches before but this just takes the biscuit. I can tolerate a bad referring performance, or cruel luck and a battling performance (Sarries, Leinster et al,) but by Christ I can not tolerate the load of continuous pish handed out to us loyal fans week after week after week. Yes we've been winning and for the life me of me I can't figure out why because we have been nothing short of atrocious this season. Think back to MA's first season in charge- hammered the Dragons at Rodney Parade and played some superb Rugby that night if my memory severs me correctly. I am in no way praising the Cowboy but things were certainly a lot easier and the blood pressure a lot more healthy when we were sitting pretty at the top of the league, qualifying for the HEC 1/4's as the top team in Europe etc.

Bar Glasgow and Leicester this season has been complete and utter tripe served up on a weekly basis, and I'm fed up of journo's and TV pundits not delivering the harsh reality of the situation because they're 'friends' with the players or represent them. To have the same tom kite game plan executed poorly week after week after week is disgraceful. And for Doak to insult the fans by coming out with tripe like last week in his interview post-Scarlets just rubs me up the wrong way.

Something needs to change, our performances don't merit our league position and I would gladly see the back of Doak, Clarke and Bell in a heartbeat.

Some of the players in this team need to take a long hard look at themselves, they only have to look and see the players who have worn this jersey: Kyle, Gibson, WJ McBride, Ferris, Muller, Humph, Pienaar, and realise there are people out there who dream of wearing this shirt and thanks to a home final possibly we have a real chance of delivering silverware and quite frankly most of this current crop just don't look interested.

Fecking Welsh.

Allow me an attempt to explain.

Even with the dross this season, we are in a league where a team like Ulster have more than 50% of games that should not be lost - though we have lost 2 of them this year - that is beyond question.

Furthermore we have some remarkable individual players who even during a dire performance will come up with moments of inspired play, often enough to win a game. Think of a completely dire performance against Scarlets, 45 minutes of utter dross, then Gilroy scores an utterly individual magical try, it was enough to inspire 10 or 15 minutes to win the game, but not enough to press on with 20 minutes to go to take a TBP.

Win the game, yet fall short of what they should have done. That has been what most games have been like, not uniformly dire, just generally stuttering performances with just enough to get by in most.

Make no mistake, we have the players to win this league, we should have done it in 2013, we might still have a go at it this year but its very hard to imagine that the players can suddenly string together 7 decent performances against goodish teams.

So part of it is that the league is poor this year, part is that we have good players, much of it is that we are making a mess of getting these good players to perform as a team in any remotely consistent way, is a conundrum within a paradox that frustrates the greatest minds.................. & our coaching staff obviously.

In short it's a feckin' miracle we are contending, given how much appears to be wrong, sadly I will be astonished if we make the final.

[DavyG]

Overall looking at the Irish performance this weekend is the influence and the "dreams" of the IRFU diluting the strengths of the individual teams within union?

Been doing that for years just it is even worse this year and the first half of next season as well

Maybe they have finally woken up to what has been staring them in the face. Ireland need 4 strong provinces to be successful and the provinces are currently being screwed into the ground by the controls and parameters handed down from Dublin.

I said it at the start of this season that the only thing of interest to the IRFU this year is the RWC, not my own thoughts but fact.

Much I would love to see the national team succeeded in all competitions there has to be some leeway shown to the provinces, at the monent they are been left to suffer at the expense of tbe national team. #AllAreEqualExceptSomeAreMoreEqualThanOthers

[bazzaj]

No I can't have that Davey and to be fair I have seen similar views.
We have player for player a better side than anything outside the top 5 and we shouldn't be losing to any of them.
D4 don't issue yellow and red cards nor do they tell people to hit late after the balls gone or tell us to aimlessly hoof the ball down the pitch.
We are the complete architects of our own downfall through ill discipline and brain dead coaching tactics.
To look elsewhere is a cop out.

[stu]

... but that is without a doubt, comfortably the worst performance I have ever seen from them. Anyone else got a comparison?

all of the '99-2000 season.

[lovesthehardground]

Wasn't going to bother posting such is my current disposition of complete and utter disillusionment with all things UR at the moment. I thought Dragons would win yesterday but didn't think our performance would be just as bad as it was. The thing is we have been playing dung pretty much all season and we're really not as good as many posters think that we are. Lets look at yesterdays team
Black - a solid scrummager but not good enough in the loose when compared to world class looseheads today.
Herring - generally consistent performer who left it too late yesterday to show his normal game.
Herbst - still in first year with UR. Maybe suffering a bit as there's no one to bring in to give him a rest?
Tuohy - coming back from injury and maybe trying too hard. But also looks to have fallen out with his colleagues. Seems in a huff about something?
VDM - steady but not world class. Said at the time I was underwhelmed when he was brought in to replace Muller.
Hendo - potential abounds but yesterday showed he's still a long way to go. Probably short of game time but has played better for Ireland in his cameo's than starting for Ulster?
Ross - anonymous. Waste of a shirt.
Williams - Busted. Had a couple of good points yesterday but looks lazy and uninterested when things don't go his way. Too many penalties given away.
Ruan - grim game yesterday
Humphreys- time to go!!
Allen - Barely Pro 12 level
Stanley - Why bother bringing him in? Play a youngster from Ulster and develop him.
Cave - maybe the captaincy got to him but a below par performance yesterday.
Scholes - worth sticking with but shocking pass from restart cost us a try at a very important time. Learn from it.
Gilroy- top class again yesterday.

Wont go thru subs as I'm bored. What I'm trying to say is that in general our squad simply isn't good enough.
World Class - Ruan, but maybe starting to fade?
International Class - Best, Bowe, Trimble, Henry
Somewhere in between- Tuohy, Jackson, Gilroy, Cave, Olding, Henderson,
Pro 12- Black, Herring, Herbst, VDM, Diack, Wilson, Payne, Marshall x2, Warrick, Ludik, McCloskey

The rest - well depending on age they should be developed or let go.
That's 23 players who are Pro 12 level as a minimum. Is it any wonder when we have injuries and intl call ups we cant put out a match day squad that competes.
Compare that to Leinster, Ospreys, Glasgow and even Munster at a push. We are still way behind having a squad that will provide world domination. Indeed we might not even dominate the AIL with our current squad.

thing is we're a poor team in a poor league and we either look to have a major overhaul and spend our abundant coffers or we just accept and stop moaning about poor performance and poor coaching. Given the latter choice probably stop buying STs to go and watch tripe while listening to utter drivel from those around you.

[ruckover]

I actually thought Stanley looked decent in the first half yesterday. I was surprised he didn't go to 10 and Arnold came on for iHumph.

[rorybestsbigbaldnoggin]

I actually thought Stanley looked decent in the first half yesterday. I was surprised he didn't go to 10 and Arnold came on for iHumph.

Too much like a good decision.

[CIMANFOREVER]

... but that is without a doubt, comfortably the worst performance I have ever seen from them. Anyone else got a comparison?

all of the '99-2000 season.

The few years before the Euro Cup win were atrocious... some awaful players that should never have been within 100 miles of an Ulster Jersey- shameful, and amateurish. Gawd Bless "H" Williams. Anyone remember an abosulte hammering by Cardiff at Ravers circa 97-98? Mackey et al propping and we were absolutely embarassed. Those games always stick in the mind, especially after the 80's and early 90's glory years.

[CIMANFOREVER]

The title of the thread perfectly sums up the most supine/ passive dsiplay I've seen from an Ulster pack in years.

Altho he's been criticised here, and I'm no fan, at least NW looked as if he was interested and showed some aggression, if little nous. That packed walked all over us. Before the game, who out of their side would you take over ours? Prydie? Coombs?

I'm going to call it as I see it, and say the unsayable - Hendo needs to start manning up. Undoubtedly massively talented, maybe we're seeing why JS is benching him. Wandering around like a Kensington dandy is not the way to play yourself into a starting Ireland or Lions squad. Even his one moment of filth wasn't really dirty fs..... just stupid.

There is no way he's the next POC or Fez ( my take after Leicester doh!) playing the way he is.
He needs full games at his age, and there's no doubt in my mind his development has been arrested by benching rather than full on games at whatever level (injuries aside.) BUT, He needs a boot in the ar*e from someone like Muller or even POC and read the riot act. He's too laid back.

However, in addition, we have a 7 who makes even Robbie Diack seem like Fez, running around clueless like a new born giraffe, a lock in FVDM who looks spent, taking the main workload all season, & DT is feeling his way back from long term injuries. For the rest, no excuse. The front row made no impression on a journeyman front row, and same can be said for the rest of the 8 against a ballsy, fired up, but limited dragons pack without Toby F.

Shocking, and only matched by the clueless tactical plan displayed by IHump and the rest of the backline.
Keep going the way we're going, and we'll lose RP, contract or not. He looks seriously p*ssed off at the lack of direction.

Shocking missed tackles as well- recently, our defence has went from impenetrable to leaky. Scholes (was hugely disappointed- another player of potential going backwards), IHump, even RP were a liability. Stanley doesn't look up to it, or he'd be a certain starter at 10, altho he's been thrown in at the deep end. Gotta question- in the past we got the likes to Terblanche as cover- experienced, but passed international call ups- what has happened to quality short termers of that ilk and Thorne? Are these guys the best we can entice, or are they all at Toulon?

Add to that the mistakes- dropped passes, turnovers on the offload (DC would you believe)- this adds up to a team that doesn't believe in itself, and probably can't believe it's second fs...

How Rory and Roger Wilson were missed yesterday.

Ultimately, as Wardy rightly called it on BBC, senior players were complacent and didn't show up. But there is something seriously rotten in the Kingdom of Denmark... Doak, Clarke et al can't seem to motivate or get the best out of a pretty creative and talented 23 with what looks like some very good young talent coming through. Out of their depth and the helm at a club like ours way too soon. We're paying the price for waiting for Kiss and his team. Probably most of the Jobs for the boys will be gone, come post RWC?..... Dinger sees it coming...

How the f*ck can we complacent when, as already posted, we could've put clear daylight between ourselves and the chasing top 3-6? Shocking lack of professionalism.

And another thing- Ryan Constable- WHY and WTF? if he's the calibre of critical appraisal the team's exposed to, no wonder we're fecked. Andy Ward was getting ansty at the meaningless drivel he was spouting. Maybe the next team talk should include Wardy and Fez telling them what it means to pull on a White Shirt- White doesn't mean surrender FS. Then stroll them down to the roll call on the Memorial Gate, and then read the new walls of previous legends. And redden their faces.

Stand up for Gillers- hopefully playing himself back into Ireland squad contention instead of Zebo the useless. Also Adair and Arnold. Fair play lads.

What a total f*cking embarassment overall.

[BuckRogers]

Hold on a second here CIMAN, it was undoubtedly one of Henderson's poorer games in an Ulster shirt but lest not forget his hugely positive impact against Leicester and his excellent bench performances for Ireland.

I dare say when you are used to Schmidt giving you detailed plans drilled down to the nth degree then you rock up to ulster who are giving you, quite possibly, nothing like that you are going to be left a little flat.

All season we have been faced with this disorganised, insipid sh1te excepting a few honourable exceptions.

I imagine yesterday was a culmination of many different factors all of which stem from the top of the 'pitch' side of things and beyond that onto the 'off pitch' side of the organisation.

Recruitment left us spread too thinly, a marked lack of quality as well has not helped at all. Coaches squabbling and quite possibly undermining eachother cannot be conducive to positive collective performances either.

Our pack have flattered to deceive for most of the season. Crushed in the opening two European fixtures we managed to get some self-respect in the last two and I gave kudos to that. When a pack, which was probably as close to first choice as we have had this season, gets beaten like that by a very average but committed dragons side then serious questions must be asked. It was absolutely horrible to watch.

Our backs clearly have talent and have shown an ability to score tries at times this season but again this seems to be more often to the individuals doing something well than systematic destruction of opponents.

The rot started up front yesterday and the malaise spread throughout the side like a disease. Cave was even, largely, crap which I don't think I've felt too often this season.

There is still a huge amount of talent available IMO but it is not being harnessed which is hugely frustrating from a spectators point of view.

Can't wait for the season to end.

[CIMANFOREVER]

Hold on a second here CIMAN, it was undoubtedly one of Henderson's poorer games in an Ulster shirt but lest not forget his hugely positive impact against Leicester and his excellent bench performances for Ireland.

I dare say when you are used to Schmidt giving you detailed plans drilled down to the nth degree then you rock up to ulster who are giving you, quite possibly, nothing like that you are going to be left a little flat.

All season we have been faced with this disorganised, insipid sh1te excepting a few honourable exceptions.

I imagine yesterday was a culmination of many different factors all of which stem from the top of the 'pitch' side of things and beyond that onto the 'off pitch' side of the organisation.

Buckie, agree with the majority of your post, as you can see to a certain extent in my own, EXCEPT for the Hendo comments- Ulster management bits aside. I love Hendo to bits; he's hugely talented, and when firing, a la Leicester, and against France for Ireland, he's ferocious- the coming man. But, he needs consistency and a bit more dander up in his game. A 70% Hendo yesterday would've made a difference. Ross, et al there are excuses for- ie just not good enough. Hendo should be our Etzebeth, but compare the two, and Hendo has stalled a bit in comparison- he was ahead at the JRWC. Still vital, and of international standard, but he needs to prove it NOW- as much to himself as to JS and others. When was his last big line break we know he's capable of? He should be scoring tries for fun. He has the pace and potential power of Fez, maybe better skills, but nowhere near the dog and cussedness currently. Unfair of me maybe, but he should be doing so much better; and I have allowed for his run of injuries. Like I said, he''s not helped by benching and 10 min here and there. But it was set up for him yesterday.

Would you build a pack around him currently, like they did with POC?

[Russ]

Honestly. I hope we finish 5th

[Cockatrice]

So we don't have the energy or the will….. where does the blame lie for that?

[Cockatrice]

I actually thought Stanley looked decent in the first half yesterday. I was surprised he didn't go to 10 and Arnold came on for iHumph.

Too much like a good decision.

we brought him here as cover for 10 god forbid we actually consider that as an option…

[Cornerfleg]

Honestly. I hope we finish 5th

Here's your hat Russ ...